Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/IncidentArchive310

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We have a problem[edit]

From b3ta's monthly newletter:

 >> Quopedia vandalism <<
 "Hello b3ta Towers," blurps danbull45, "We
 would like to divulge to you the following very
 sinister secret. Using a variety of aliases and
 cunning page edits, we have now subtly shopped
 Status Quo into nearly 200 different photos on
 Wikipedia. Our aim is for every image in
 Wikipedia to have Teh Quo hidden somewhere
 within it. We'd like to show you the fruits of
 our labour, but for obvious reasons can't
 reveal the location of each image - so here is
 a taster of our handiwork. Perhaps your
 newsletter's readers could aid us in our
 glorious mission?"

Looks like the vandalism was caught, but what other images have they been fiddling with? - Ta bu shi da yu 07:04, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

Ooh, clever little buggers. I've filed a CheckUser request, just in case it might help. —Ilmari Karonen (talk) 21:31, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Perhaps we should have a policy that any revisions to images that don't change that image in any visible way should always be reverted.
Equazcionargue/improves21:35, 10/13/2007
That would not have helped in this case. Further details omitted per WP:BEANS, though it's not that hard to figure out. —Ilmari Karonen (talk) 03:27, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Anon user is back with more personal attacks[edit]

User (who is obviously, same edit summaries, same info, same attacks) is once again engaging in personal attacks and disruptive behaviour. (see original IP's talk page for warnings given in previous incident) on the USS Liberty Incident page. Narson 15:58, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

Indeed. This and this appear to be quite similar. Cheers, ( arky ) 16:19, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

Just a minor addendum: I do realise that assuming they are one and the same could be seen as failing to AGF, however I think its obvious to the point that not assuming it would be 'putting out your eyes to maintain the NPOV of your nose', so to speak.Narson 16:29, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

Comment - I'm not sure that would violate AGF would it? Rudget Editor Review 16:39, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Not a violation of AGF. AGF doesn't require us to stick our heads in the ground. Anyways, I blocked the IP for 24 hours. JoshuaZ 00:11, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Nationalistic edits[edit]

User:Kukar is making nationalistic edits on wikipedia. For evidence of this statement I will give example of his edits in article Vrlika. This is link for his changes [[1]] . For me it is clear that his only changes are deleting of Croats name and changing that with south slavic or not speaking about few facts (old Catholic church, influence of the Frankish Empire, today demography of this "city"). --Rjecina 19:52, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

This is a routine content dispute not requiring administrator intervention. Please discuss the matter using the article's talk page (or communicate directly with the other editor). Raymond Arritt 20:00, 13 October 2007 (UTC)


JunKazamaFan (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · edit filter log · block user · block log) is currently (as I type this) harassing User:TTN at User talk:TTN, by repeatedly replacing questions/accusations multiple times after TTN removed them. Also has made a personal attack on his user page: User:JunKazamaFan which has already been removed several times, only to be replaced by either him or User:Angie Y.. -WarthogDemon 20:30, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

This is no excuse whatsoever, but TTN hasn't been making any friends with his 'delete first and to hell with questions' attitude. I'm not involved in any way with this and, as I said, there's no call for harrassment, but I've seen his name come up quite often and not many people have nice things to say about him. HalfShadow 20:37, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Controversial or not, this is indeed ridiculous. I haven't agreed with some of the things he's done either but I do understand what he's doing. At any rate, this is less about TTN's activities and more about being harrassed and attacked on the user's page. -WarthogDemon 20:41, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Not sure what to think of this. JuJube 21:39, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
My opinion is that it was intended humorously, but I've asked, just to be sure. - Philippe | Talk 21:51, 13 October 2007 (UTC)



User:Jesusforever is engaging in vandalism at Evolution as theory and fact.--Filll 21:37, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

Vandalism reporting is thataway-> HalfShadow 21:39, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
User blocked for vandalism. - Philippe | Talk 21:47, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Am I the only one here thinking that he should be nameblocked based on both his name (Criterion 5) and the article he's been vandalizing? -Jéské(v^_^v) 03:58, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
I dunno, I don't think the name is inherently offensive, although the edits themselves are. Do you think people who aren't so into Jesus would necessarily have a hard time with this name?--The Fat Man Who Never Came Back 04:05, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Actually, this can be seen as invok[ing] the name of a religious figure in a... provocative way and promot[ing] one religion over another (Christianity). -Jéské(v^_^v) 04:09, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
You (unintentionally, I'm sure) left out an equally relevant part of this policy: "Note that simple expressions of faith are allowed unless they are disruptive, but are discouraged."--The Fat Man Who Never Came Back 04:12, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Given that he's been vandalizing an article on evolution, I'd say that this is beyond that and into invoking the name of a religious figure in a provocative way. I'll yield on the promotion part, but I still feel he's invoking Jesus to vandalize articles his particular religious views may disagree with. -Jéské(v^_^v) 04:16, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

User: Scrimmer87[edit]

the user Scrimmer87 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · edit filter log · block user · block log) has apparently created this account for the sole purpose of vandalizing articles. Could some one please summarily give them twenty lashes with a wet noodle, then excommunicate them?

(So I'm bored with the simple requests of please block this guy)

- Jeremy (Jerem43 23:23, 13 October 2007 (UTC))

No. You have not even tried to talk to him, and even if you had and had got nowhere, you should go to Administrator intervention against vandalism and not here. Sam Blacketer 23:36, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
After you revert vandalism edits, it is recommended you warn the vandal, the warnings at WP:UTM are commonly used. Mr.Z-man 00:29, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
How can you tell that an account is "vandalism-only" when he's made a total of two edits? -- llywrch 00:41, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Did you read them? They were both vandalism, very obvious vandalism. Over the past few months I have observed the trend where newly created accounts that start off vandalizing with their first edit, continue to do so. Usually asking these types of editor (vandals) to stop or posting warnings on their talk pages is ineffective as they don't really care about niceties. Personal observation and opinion, not a commentary on you posts, and the reason for me posting when and what I did. - Jeremy (Jerem43 01:16, 14 October 2007 (UTC))

I have observed that many vandal only editors have a contrib history that lasts one day (or, more exactly, one evening) - the next day their hangover is so bad they cannot remember the password they used the night before. It is a waste of time placing an indef block template on their page the day after the event. If they are not caught in the act then forget about them until such time the account is reactivated. LessHeard vanU 02:03, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Still, you're not going to get a lot of admin support if you don't at least tell people not to vandalize. They were more like childish "wow, I can really do this"-type stuff. There's much nastier vandalism that gets immediate blocks. If he continues after warnings (if it's blatant, use {{Blatantvandal}}), then he'll be blocked. Also, I don't know if you've noticed but he stopped right after the warning. No need for a block. Who knows, it's actually possible for him to become a helpful editor afterwards. We'll see. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 02:06, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Warnings DO work, especially if you keep an eye on the vandals. I check back almost every day and escalate as appropriate, and go to WP:AIV if needed. When these vandals find out that someone is watching them, many stop their vandalism and make useful contributions. Sometimes it takes a block but you won't get a block if you don't warn first. I've watched a whole lot of editors who vandalized daily but eventually learned better and went two or three weeks without any vandalism and sometimes with useful contributions. If I had not warned them and sometimes requested a block, those vandals likely would have continued vandalizing every day. Sbowers3 03:12, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

AIV backlog[edit]

Resolved: Backlog cleared.

Can we get some lovin' at WP:AIV? The backlog is growing pretty large. Thanks! --ElKevbo 00:58, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Lovin' received and backlog cleared (ew - I didn't realize those two phrases might mean something when put together like that...). Thanks! --ElKevbo 01:26, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Return of PatPeter[edit]

I'm hesitant, though I think it's likely. So I'll directly ask for others to view:

Is User:Sox207, User:PatPeter?

I find him creating sub-pages of PatPeter's userpages. He's setting up the same "rules" (and using the same wording) in userboxes. He seems to have the same tone, and uses similar phrasing ("Seriously"). And he's editing inactive userpages based on his "rules".

I ran into him changing userboxes against concensus at Wikipedia:Userboxes, and WP:UCFD. Though the more I talked with him, and the more I looked into his edit history, the more I think he is. He even started editing when PatPeter stopped.

However, I don't think I can request a CU, as this might fall under "just curious". (It looks like it would fall under "F".)

I'd appreciate it if others would check this out and offer insight. - jc37 00:15, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

See Wikipedia:Requests for checkuser/Case/PatPeter for more information. - jc37 19:50, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
Possible - let's see how the checkuser goes. DurovaCharge! 14:23, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

DGG is not a neutral admin[edit]

I would like to bring to all of your notice that DGG is not a neutral admin, or at least his admin actions do not suggest so. DGG, it appears, has deleted the older comments I had posted to his talk page concerning these issues. I suggest if he cannot be neutral he should please give up his admin rights. I am speaking with valid reference. He have been very well aware of the articles on Hindi Programming Language and Hindawi Programming System; in fact he created a disambiguation page for Hindawi where he linked in both of these. Now, today he have deleted the list of keywords and certain other material from the Hindawi Programming System page while he has not done so with the Hindi Programming Language page. The keywords were added to the HPS page yesterday, but they have all through been there on the HPL page. DGG explain his actions and the lack of neutrality. Further, the chain of events go like this. There was an older page on Hindawi which referred to the Hindawi Programming System. He first changed its contents to an advertisement like article on Hindawi Publishing Corporation, without ever discussing it. Then he move the company related article to a different name and redirected Hindawi to the new page. Please open any other encyclopedia and see what Hindawi refers to. Even though I assume good intent, I found a DGG comment on another admins' page requesting support in dealing with me [2]. This was outrageous. I am really let down by the manner in which DGG is handling his admin responsibilities. Please let the _open_ spirit of WP survive DGG - an honest humble request. Please be neutral. When you marked Hindawi Programming System for deletion even though it was not at all intended so, I presumed good intent and believed the article needed restructuring. Why then do you behave so differently about Hindi Programming Language where the advertisement intent of an completely unreferenced article has been admitted clearly by the author?

For those of you who may be interested Hindawi Programming System is a well referenced and reviewed piece of open source software which has been well recognised internationally, with even Linux Magazine reviewing it. Unfortunately its name clashes with a commercial entity. The rest is all evident. Is WP another yellow pages?

I expect an honest and well balanced / well judged response from the community. Hi pedler 04:48, 13 October 2007 (UTC)hi_pedler Hi pedler 04:48, 13 October 2007 (UTC)hi_pedler

I'd just like to point out that any editor, admins included, are allowed to remove whatever they want from their talk pages.
Equazcionargue/improves04:51, 10/13/2007
Especially when they're delightful material such as this. I don't understand why any of this has to do with him being an admin, or "neutral", or why it's anything but a content dispute with someone who has a COI in this respect. --Haemo 04:54, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
To reinforce Equazcion's point, I have also been told by administrators that removing messages from talk pages is actually okay, because they are still available in the talk page history. As pertains to DGG, I have found him to be quite neutral and objective in any of my dealings with him and I overall think he is one of the finest administrators that I have interacted with on this site. Sincerely, --Le Grand Roi des CitrouillesTally-ho! 04:57, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Why is he being non neutral then? This is explained above with respect to the way he has dealt with the article on Hindawi and all the related articles. WP has lost its spirit, as per the comments above. It should probably be called a yellow pages and not an encyclopedia if articles about commercial entities are given prefernce over encyclopedic articles. Hi pedler 05:05, 13 October 2007 (UTC)hi_pedler
Agreed fully. I sometimes disagree with DGG on specific issues (it would be a dull world if everyone agreed on everything) but I have never found him anything other than civil, fair and knowledgeable. Remarks like this and this, in contrast, show Hi pedler to be needlessly overbearing. Raymond Arritt 05:16, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
DGG's boringly neutral. Not even I can find fault with him as an administrator. He'll also listen to you if you put your case out and may agree to change something because you've offered sufficient evidence. It is hard to follow what you're saying here or accusing him of, though. Maybe sticking with the facts at issue rather than your perception of DGG and extraneous issues about talk page deletions could clear the matter up. KP Botany 06:32, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Support DGG as well. I've also dealt with Hi pedler as well. There is also some serious COI concerns. I've even been accused of working with DGG [3][4] simply for having commented on possibly articles from Hi pedler. Again, Hi pedler, you need to be more specific about what you find not neutral from DGG. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 06:40, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
I also support DGG's neutrality. While I don't always agree with him, he always does his best (IMO) to maintain a polite and neutral atmosphere. ···日本穣? · Talk to Nihonjoe 06:44, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
As someone who have often disagreed with DGG on AfD I have to second that. I have never found him to be anything more than a guy who presents his point of view politely and often quite convinsingly. Move along, there is nothing to see here. EconomicsGuy 06:45, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
We should preserve this little set of commentaries, because I think DGG's neutrality is the only thing this set of editors has ever and ever will agree upon. Can we get it framed in gold or something? KP Botany 06:53, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
I don't know that I've ever run into any of the other editors here other than DGG (who technically isn't here, but...) ···日本穣? · Talk to Nihonjoe 06:56, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Ha. It's true. The fact that people on both sides of many disputes agree on this means that he really must be neutral. I especially agree with the "...boringly so" comment, it's funny someone said that, as I was thinking the same thing. As for this particular dispute, which I'm sure the OP is getting frustrated that no one is commenting on, it's kind of hard to follow. I can't speak for everyone else but I myself am just confused by the situation as the OP has described it, and was waiting for DGG to come and clear this up for us.
Equazcionargue/improves07:03, 10/13/2007
Why was one article treated differently than the other? Without the specifics (your complaint was excessively broad, to the point of not actually saying anything, and just a quite unconvincing appeal to emotion), I can't say, but in general, what happens to one article in the deletion process does not affect the status of other articles. I can't say I've seen DGG do anything wrong here. Titoxd(?!? - cool stuff) 07:02, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Thank you every one. The few words I wrote above are _too long_ ? What should its length have been? Here are the specifics
  • 1. Now, today he has deleted the list of keywords and certain other material from the Hindawi Programming System while he has not done so with the Hindi Programming Language. The keywords were added to the HPS page yesterday, but they have all through been there on the HPL page. Refer programming languages
  • 2. There was an older page on Hindawi which referred to the Hindawi Programming System. He first changed its contents to an advertisement like article on Hindawi Publishing Corporation, without ever discussing it. Then he moved the company related article to a different name and redirected Hindawi to the new page. Please open any other encyclopedia and see what Hindawi refers to.

Is that specific enough? Hi pedler 10:08, 13 October 2007 (UTC)hi_pedler

Some more points:

This is my last comment on this topic here. One more thing, Ricky81682 has made a last comment on Hindi Programming Language discussion page in a manner which leaves more deserving of an admin.

The major point here is why doesn't DGG discuss something before deleting when it is a contested topic. Hi pedler 10:20, 13 October 2007 (UTC)hi_pedler

I do not always agree with DGG- far from it. However, I have to support him completely in this instance.--Filll 16:17, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
In view of all the support above, comment might seem superfluous, but I offered last night to re-examine the balance between the two programming system articles--I gather there is an intellectual property rights dispute between them--and to invite a specialist if we still disagreed (as I have no personal experience of how to program in Hindi), upon which Hi pedlar preferred to bring it here. But I first noticed this after an attempt by both Hi pedlar and some anon. to remove the article on the competitive programming language and on a publisher whose name resembled that of the company whose article he supports. First I've heard of BangaBhasha, but as Hi pedlar seems to have been editing it, someone else might want to take a look at it. But Hi pedlar is right about the name of the publisher, about which he might be more familiar than I, so I'm moving it from H.P. Company to ... H. P. Corporation as he just now suggested.18:17, 13 October 2007 (UTC) (This was posted by User:DGG but does not seem to have his name for some reason. KP Botany 20:15, 13 October 2007 (UTC))
In full disclosure, the comment from me that Hi pedler is discussing is here. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 01:54, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
  • I'm personally positive DGG isn't nuetral... I'll be damned if I can prove it though...JJJ999 05:17, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Thank you DGG for the response. As about an expert taking a look at these articles, well I have personally wanted the same all through. I understand that WP is not the forum for deciding the IP rights conflict between the two programming systems, and I have earlier said the same in as many words. Request DGG to maintain the composure he has shown above and be a bit patient in applying speedy. Lets have a healthy attitude towards developing positive content. As about getting my contributions reviewed in general - I'll be the happiest. 05:50, 14 October 2007 (UTC)hi_pedler
Another point - DGG has barred me from editing the above refernced pages. This is a violation of my right to free speech and I take it seriously. I understand the rules to WP hold their ground but DGG has no business barring my fundamental rights. Hi pedler 06:05, 14 October 2007 (UTC)hi_pedler
Only one person is positive that DGG is not neutral - amazing! Hi pedler 06:07, 14 October 2007 (UTC)hi_pedler
You have no right to free speech on Wikipedia. Freedom of speech provides that the government cannot abridge your right to free speech in public. This right has no effect on whether or not the private entity Wikipedia allows you to edit its content. --Cheeser1
ha ha ha... ho ho ho... I feel like I should burst out laughing... why was I wasting my time in the above then?? Hi pedler 06:27, 14 October 2007 (UTC)hi_pedler
But the problem here is you're simply not going to get a rise out of DGG by accusing him of being other than neutral or a discussion on anything but the topic at hand, which is the article and editorial concerns about it, because that's pretty much what DGG does here: edits and discusses articles. He boringly replied to your accusations in just this manner above. And this discussion has pretty much shown exactly what I said above: DGG is boringly neutral. KP Botany 06:41, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Harassment by admin[edit]

This admin, Moreschi (talk · contribs) together with Folantin (talk · contribs) is I believe harrasing me. After a WP:CSB discussion (in which these two were instrumental) I believe they are watching my edits and trying to obstruct me where possible. I don't mind to discuss anything with them, but when Folantin (talk · contribs) calls me a 'chauvinist', and I subsequently add a comment and remove this line[5] , Moreschi (talk · contribs) not only readds the personal attack, but also removes my comment, twice, despite my clearly noted objections.Rex 10:57, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

I'm just trying to keep an eye on your little mission to exaggerate the "Dutchness" of Ludwig van Beethoven, Rex. Somebody has to. I'm sick to the back teeth of editors whose only interest in the subject of an article is their ethnicity, nationality, linguistic affiliation etc. etc.. If we don't watch them we end up with lameness like this [6]. --Folantin 11:13, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for proving my suspicions. As you refered to refered to WP:LAME, I assume you're also familiar with WP:POINT? You know what pisses me off? Editors who do not edit wikipedia to improve it, but to activly seek trouble and conflict with other users without any objective reason and merely prejudice.Rex 11:28, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
You must be pretty mad at yourself then. There's a pretty good reason why you're banned from going anywhere near articles on German subjects (which happens to include quite a few members of the Van Beethoven family). --Folantin 11:35, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Read the outcome Folantin, I know what I can and can't do and this isn't can't do. Anyway, do keep talking like this, It makes it easier for the admins to see who's doing what and why. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Rex Germanus (talkcontribs) 11:47, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
I'm sure they'll also note that you were blocked on September 30 for 24 days [7]. On October 1, you were granted a "restrictive unblock" to take part in the Community Sanctions debate about you. Not sure that your recent editing history is really covered by that. --Folantin 11:52, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Actually it is, though it's exempalry of your behaviour that despite being unsure and not knowing the facts, you still have a clear opinion on others. I tend to work differently. I for example, am sure that this doesnt matter at all. Being blocked doesn't give you a letter of marque to obstruct, harrass and offend without reprisal. Even though you yourself seem to think so.Rex 12:00, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
ADD: Note the fine choice of words by Folantin .... Rex 12:02, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Lest we forget, Rex's current block is for WP:POINT, persistent conflictual edits, chronical failure to work for the project rather than use it for personal crusades. No doubt he'll be going after the blocking admin User:Rama for harrassment too. --Folantin 12:31, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

Rex has a long history of problematic editing. He persistently pushes a highly pro-Dutch POV on the one hand, and an strongly anti-German one on the other. This is well-known, and calling a spade a spade is hardly a personal attack. Even if it was, NPA does not really permit the removal of such attacks. Rex's complaining here is a complete waste of everyone's time, and his POV-pushing is getting worse and worse, and more and more flagrant. If he doesn't start editing neutrally he'll have to be banned altogether. Moreschi Talk 12:11, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

I don't know wether to laugh or cry, you removed a comment and readded an attack. Twice. No matter how many blocks you digg up. It is not an excuse. I provide sources and explained my actions. If anyone here is editing based on POV its you.Rex 12:42, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
This is complete rubbish. Everyone knows what type of editor you are. This is really self-evident. No point denying the obvious. Remember the "German peasant blood", anyone? If you don't, here's the diff. Moreschi Talk 12:45, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
The what-now? Let's tone it down. I'm having difficulties following what going on here, but I'm not seeing any harassment, either. El_C 12:52, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Hey, that's not fair, you used a time machine! El_C 13:01, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
All I'm seeing here is a load of bitch slapping, but no harassment. AecisBrievenbus 12:57, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
You're still on probation, Rex. We're supposed to be watching your edits. Will (talk) 12:54, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Exactly. It's about maintaining Wikipedia's accuracy in the face of known POV-pushers. It was pretty obvious Rex would head straight back to his Beethoven campaign. Rex wasn't happy when I agreed with User:Fram and provided sources showing that Beethoven's ancestors were Flemish, thus fulfilling WP:V. Rex then went into some long, convoluted argument trying to prove that there were no Flemings at the time and so Ludwig's granddad was obviously Dutch, even though he came from what's now Belgium rather than the Netherlands. Most biographies of Beethoven spend very little time on the composer's more distant family background, usually contenting themselves with noting he was of "Flemish ancestry" before getting on to the details of his life and music. This being Wikipedia, of course, editor priorities seem to be exactly the reverse. --Folantin 13:06, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
(ec) I see no harassment and I also see that Rex Germanus was released early from a block only to defend himself, but instead has simply returned to the behavior that got him blocked in the first place. The previous block should be resumed and possibly lengthened. —Wknight94 (talk) 12:56, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Agreed with wknight94. I'm not seeing any harassment here, just a return to the old ways. You're on probation, of course you're being watched, that's sort of the point. 'Ad-hoc additional topic or article bans' - here's your kicker. ~ Riana 13:00, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

Why do we still have {{rpa}}? That's just a recepy for trouble, seeing how WP:RPA is long dead and buried. El_C 13:05, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

Last time I checked WATCHING does not involve obstructing or making offensive comments. I for one, am able to watch things WITHOUT calling people chauvinist or readding such attacks and removing comments. Especially an admin ought to know better. Rex 14:41, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
With that said, when is the 24-day block going to resume? Shall I reinstate it myself? —Wknight94 (talk) 14:43, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
The block was abandond after WP:CSB. Days ago.[8]. How easy admins forget that this discussion isn't about me, but others.Rex 14:51, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Hmmm. There's a rider on User:Jossi's comment: any related disruption will be taken very seriously and will be swiftly followed by an immediate 1 month block. --Folantin 15:00, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

I can't believe we're still dealing with this guy. Raymond Arritt 15:07, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

Done deal. One month block. [9] If this thread isn't disruption, I don't know what is. - Jehochman Talk 15:13, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Phew! Thank heavens for that. --Folantin 15:21, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Agree with this block; any edits beyond his own defense (reason for restricted unblock) where a favour, Rex should have been careful not to abuse this leniency. That admins (who are not his old enemies) were thinking about disruptive edits are (IMHO) in this situation enough for a block. Arnoutf 16:44, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
This is the ninth time Rex Germanus has been blocked since being put on probation. I'm thinking the ArbCom might be interested in hearing that. Seems to me that serious bans have been levied for less disruptive cases. —Wknight94 (talk) 20:19, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Coincidentally I was just reviewing this case and thought "when you have to use the vertical scrollbar to see someone's complete block log, there are problems other than monitor size." Raymond Arritt 20:24, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Whaaa? Nine blocks since starting probation? That's crazy talk. Endorse the current block and I support Ray's comment below that the next stop is Indef Central. Rex, if you're still reading, please make sure that you're not back on this board for a tenth go post-probation. Sarah 11:21, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Not seeking, per se, to be hard-assed about it, but with only half that number of legitimate blocks we've community banned people beforehand. Is anyone going to ArbCom with this, or do we want to do this here and now? ➔ REDVEЯS isn't wearing pants 20:27, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

Since he has already crossed the ArbCom's path, an entry at WP:RFAR#Motions in prior cases may be best. —Wknight94 (talk) 20:40, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
...and this will write itself; or are we waiting for a volunteer or something? ➔ REDVEЯS isn't wearing pants 21:29, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
For now, I would say, let him sit out his block of one month; and let this be a last warning; the actual German topic banning may not have been clearly communicated. I would suggest posting a message on his talkpage stating something like:
You are banned from engaging in any type of edits concerning German naming for an indefinite time span. Any breach may result in a block without further discussion. You are also put on indefinite 1RR parole. Incivility of you will be no longer tolerated. Breach of these conditions may lead to an indefinite community ban (ie you being kicked out of the Wiki project).
Or a sinilar warning. If he decides to be disrupitve again after something like that, I will no longer defend him (as I did in the past because he also made many worthwhile edits)Arnoutf 00:08, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
I am not convinced that further leniency will do any good at all. I have requested a siteban from Arbcom. [10] If Rex Germanus realizes that his actions have real, lasting consequences, he may change his approach. A siteban need not be permanent. If he chooses to take a more constructive approach, we should welcome him to return. Until then, we should not allow him to continue gaming our processes. - Jehochman Talk 00:56, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
It's probably best not to get into a block / unblock /reblock etc. situation. Let's let the current one-month block run itself out, then at the next offense it will be indef. Raymond Arritt 01:02, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Arbcom are familiar with the situation, and should have a chance to decide if this is the final straw, or not. If they choose not to ban him this time, I agree that next time should be an indef. Let's see what they say. - Jehochman Talk 01:09, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

(after archiving) An arbitrator has suggested that either the community can place a ban, or we can bring a new Arbcom case. [11] - Jehochman Talk 04:34, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

Sockpuppet question[edit]

I just indef blocked User:IceManReturns as a vandal only account. It is also patently obvious that this account is a sockpuppet of User:IceManNJD, who was blocked for one week on September 22 for precisely the same vandalism. Given that this individual has not edited from the latter account since that block expired, but instead chose to use a sock, what, if anything, should be done about the main account? Resolute 18:14, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

Given that it's obvious we're dealing with a purposeful, recidivist vandal I'd indefblock both of them. Be sure to hang the appropriate sockpuppet templates on their pages as a convenience for admins dealing with future occurrences, which unfortunately seem likely in this situation. Raymond Arritt 19:43, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Raymond, could you take care of this yourself? Shalom (HelloPeace) 17:50, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Obvious sock[edit]

Joker828 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · page moves · block user · block log) and CptHowdy (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · page moves · block user · block log) are obvious socks of Laughing Joker (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · page moves · block user · block log) blocked indef two days ago. All have made the same edit to creationism:[12],[13],[14].  – ornis 00:40, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

I have added suspected sockpuppet tags to the user pages for future reference. Thanks. Tbo 157(talk) (review) 01:09, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
No worries. Should I open a suspected sock report, a RFCU? It seems like a pretty clear cut case of abusive use of socks to evade a block, not to mention 3RR.  – ornis 01:22, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
I will put in a report at Wikipedia:Suspected sock puppets unless an admin takes any action here as it is quite obvious that these accounts are sockpuppets. Tbo 157(talk) (review) 01:26, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
I have added a report at Wikipedia:Suspected sock puppets/Laughing Joker. You may add any additional evidence or comments you have to the page. Tbo 157(talk) (review) 01:44, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
No I reckon, you pretty much summed it up. Thanks for that. It may still be worth a checkuser to turn up any sleepers if at all possible, but perhaps for now it's best to leave it at that till someone with the buttons has had a look.  – ornis 01:53, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
No problems. I don't think checkuser cases would be appropriate in this case. Checkusers cases are only normally opened when there is constant abuse from multiple suspected sockpuppet accounts with a lack of evidence. Tbo 157(talk) (review) 11:15, 14 October 2007 (UTC)


This user appears to have no understanding of or perhaps respect for image copyrights. He's been warned dozens of times. I propose an indef block, but would like a 2nd opinion. Rklawton 01:07, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Indefinite might be a bit harsh. I'd support a week (maybe even a month) at first and if he starts again, then indefinite. He did seem to have some good edits a while back but he definitely needs to learn. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 01:19, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
I agree. I don't think an indefinite block straight away is appropriate. Tbo 157(talk) (review) 01:29, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
I also agree. Personally, I would go with a one to two week block, but that's just me. I think it should be noted that a block is a way to prevent damage to the encyclopedia, and not a punishment. Happy editing, ( arky ) 02:06, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
His recent edits overall are odd, changing the photo tag on Norman Mailer[15], bizarrely resizing an image [16], and removing a tag without explanation [17]? I'd say two weeks to a month for all the wierdness. ThuranX 06:39, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

OK. I've warned him about his image uploads, and I'll keep an eye on his edits. I've also notified him of this thread. He hasn't edited since. However, if he resumes this pattern, I'll block him in sequence: week, month, 6 months, indef. Rklawton 16:49, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Probable vandalism related to airline destinations[edit]

Recently, there has been a large amount of editing to articles listing airline destinations - Aerolíneas Argentinas destinations is one, as is Air New Zealand destinations, but there are a lot more (and I'm probably not aware of most of them). Basically, somebody keeps adding claims that the airlines are due to start flying somewhere, but the information is never sourced and I can't find information to support them. The editing is mostly by anonymous IPs, which change frequently. The additions are persistent and often implausible enough that I strongly doubt they're good faith, but I thought I'd see what other people thought. Even if it isn't vandalism, I think something needs to be done to stop these numerous unverified additions (which keep getting readded despite requests for evidence). Sorry if this is the wrong place - I'm not too familiar with the process. -- Vardion 05:33, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

I've been aware of the same issue on international airport articles, eg Auckland International Airport. It's probably the same editor each time. Sometimes I've done mass rollbacks (and never had a complaint), but I worry that I'm going to bite some well-meaning editor who has made a genuine but unsourced update of an airline schedule.-gadfium 06:13, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
There's some sort of SPAM/COI stuff going, if one judges by the edit summaries, which use 'we' in the corrections, see [18] for examples. If it weren't for the '...jesus' endings, I'd be more inclined to assume it's a company man doing it, as is, I'm suspecting it's a sarcastic company guy doing it. ThuranX 06:34, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Having looked a bit further, I suspect there is at least one genuine contributor in the mess somewhere. However, weeding out these genuine contributions from the repeated insertions of unverified and implausible material is likely to be a challenge. I would also note that the the person adding the non-legitimate stuff seems to know enough about Wikipedia to use the Undo function, and so presumably will have noticed that his/her edits are being reverted with requests for citations. If so, it makes the situation look like deliberate vandalism rather than well-meaning ignorance. -- Vardion 06:54, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Oh, and now they've blanked my user page. -- Vardion 06:56, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
I've blocked the most recent IP address, (talk · contribs), for a week, since their blanking of Vardion's user page was clearly not good faith. I've also added Air New Zealand destinations to my watchlist.-gadfium 08:02, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Useful new feature[edit]

The undeletion process now seems to have an option to invert the selection (ie. change all selected edits into unselected and vice-versa). That is useful. Please pass my thanks to the programmer. Anthony Appleyard 05:52, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

You may thank DerHexer over at Common.js; it's a little bit of javascript added to sysop.js. EdokterTalk 14:20, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Sock puppet-[edit]

Resolved: No action is needed. Shalom (HelloPeace) 17:48, 14 October 2007 (UTC) is a user violating the forbidden uses of sock puppets to avoid scrutiny from other editors. He admitted it.[19] 06:31, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Blatantly untrue. The edit you reference was, back then, me telling Angie that I was logging as an anon IP because I had reason to believe I was being Wikistalked under my actual Wikipedia name. It was not "because I was violating the forbidden uses of sockpuppets". And, FYI, the Wikistalking you're doing of me at Meg Griffin and other places IS a violation of Wikipedia policies. 09:41, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Nothing to see here. The edit in question was in June 4, 2007, four months ago. I recently reviewed WP:SOCK and I frequently check WP:SSP. It is permitted to login as an alternate account or anon if you're afraid that someone might be harassing you and following your every edit. That being said, it's impolite to lob accusations at an admin without revealing who you are. Shalom (HelloPeace) 17:48, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Bot removed my edit?[edit]

I added a "References in popular culture" headlines to the Mutt and Jeff article, but the ClueBot removed it automaticly. Is that not a valid edit? -- Kirjapan 14:41, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

  • It was because it was added material that contained the word "gay". Just revert it. Though some would say a bot that automatically removed "in popular culture" sections would be a good thing. ELIMINATORJR 15:11, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
  • The bot does occasionally make mistakes. ClueBot is open to being reverted. Regards, Mercury 15:12, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
    • And you might want to let Cobi, who operates the bot, know of the error as he uses this kind of feedback to try to improve the code. Newyorkbrad 16:53, 14 October 2007 (UTC) (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · edit filter log · block user · block log)[edit]


This IP went through a large number of baseball articles yesterday, adding sneaky vandalism to all of them (i.e. changing birthplaces and career statistics to subtly incorrect values). Would someone with rollback mind doing the honors? It'd take forever to fix by hand. -Hit bull, win steak(Moo!) 15:02, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Done. That's nothing much. I once reverted about 70 vandalisms by an impersonator. So about 10 here is not much at all. :D Maxim(talk) (contributions) 15:09, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Need assistance educating user about RfC protocol[edit]


User:Duke53 is the subject of an RfC that I opened. He has tried to respond inline to the statements made instead of using his own Response section. I undid his first comment and dropped him a note about the proper procedure so he could put it in the right place, but it doesn't seem to have been heeded. I'm uncomfortable with undoing any more of his responses, or moving them, since I'm an involved party. Could a neutral admin please help Duke53 make sure his responses end up in the right spot? I'm asking for an admin rather than any uninvolved editor because I think Duke53's more likely to take the admin's word on how to conduct an RfC. Thanks, alanyst /talk/ 15:26, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Request for outside views on administrative action[edit]

Moved to WP:AN. Mercury 18:14, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Legal threat from Ampcometal[edit]

User:Ampcometal has sent me a legal threat by email regarding my edits to Unified numbering system. He made no attempt to resolve the issue through discussion. I believe that WP:SUE indicates he should be blocked and I should withdraw from further editing to that page until the legal issue is resolved, is that correct?--Yannick 17:45, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

I'd suggest just ignoring the emails. Unless a user is making threats onwiki, it is extremely difficult to confirm that threats are actually being made. --- RockMFR 17:48, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
I can forward the email if you would like. It came from an address I don't feel I can ignore this threat, and I would like to see the admins uphold policy.--Yannick 17:57, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
If the user is e-mailing you through the "e-mail this user" button, don't respond and that user will not get your e-mail address. 1 != 2 18:01, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
First of all, it's too late. I advertise my real name on my user page, and Ampcometal found my email address elsewhere on the internet. Secondly, hiding behind pseudonyms is a childish way to deal with legal issues, and would likely prove ineffective before the courts.--Yannick 18:06, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

By the way, I've blocked Ampcometal for obviously promotional username. MaxSem 18:12, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

LART request[edit]

Any chance of an admin having a word with Jozzage for this little fit of pique. These sort of things make New Page Patrol so worthwhile and enjoyable. He's so wound up he even thinks I'm American. :) ---- WebHamster 00:34, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

I dunno, an account which has done little more than repeatedly submitted the same article for an unnotable band, then repeatedly (again) drops the f-bomb because he doesn't like the response deserves more than a simple "don't do this again or else" message. Based on this clear evidence, I blocked him for a month; review welcome. (And some people say above that I mollicoddle the troublemakers...) -- llywrch 01:04, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Oh, strong support. He's been nowhere near civil and he's not even attempting to learn why he article got deleted. Hopefully, he acts a little more contrite when he returns. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 01:09, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Many thanks. These little outbursts don't actually bother me, in truth the mental images they instigate have me chuckling, but I wouldn't want my thick skin allowing them to think they can get away with it. ---- WebHamster 01:20, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

I just noticed Mr.Z-man has extended this user's block to indefinite. I guess it is safe to conclude from this incident that "You suck" is not a reason for being unblocked. (No points if you can't tell my tone of voice here.) -- llywrch 20:30, 14 October 2007 (UTC)


Resolved: "Bot" blocked indefinitely. — madman bum and angel 00:00, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Someone may want to look at User:SugerMagnoliaBOT, it looks like it nom'ed Philadelphia for AfD on it's own [20] Yngvarr 00:34, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

He/she/it has been indef blocked. --Haemo 00:41, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
I'm curious as to how it possibly could have seen Philadelphia as an Article For Deletion . . . -WarthogDemon 00:43, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
I'm guessing some experienced vandal created a vandal-only account that impersonates a bot to try to disrupt Wikipedia. Its probably not an actual bot... --Hdt83 Chat 00:45, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Hmm, that seems to be the case. -WarthogDemon 00:47, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

It didn't have a bot flag; it was simply a misleading username per Wikipedia:Username policy. — madman bum and angel 00:00, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

A user's insulting and confrontational behavior[edit]

The background
Bamadude (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · edit filter log · block user · block log) is a problematic and tendentious editor whose behavior needs the attention of the wider community. He is currently the subject of a complaint at Wikiquette alerts (I'm not involved) and has exhibited "bullying" behavior at both Talk:Larry_Seidlin and Talk:Taxi_(TV_series) (his first response to the complaint at wikiquette was this comment).
My involvement and BD at Larry Seidlin talkpage
(Disclaimer, fyi, my involvement, etc.) I first ran across BD at village pump and noticed his confrontational and slightly hostile comments there (everybody's 'stupid' plus Z-man doesn't read and BD cites international law, sort of). Due to his comments, I added one of the pages he edits to my watchlist (Larry_Seidlin). I discovered that he really wants that article deleted, I don't know why, but it is a crusade of his (If you think I exaggerate, see the talk page).

Feeling bad about the way User:Prgrmr@wrk was being treated (and, so far, typical for how Bamadude interacts with just about everyone), I finally made a comment and it went thusly:

  • Bamadude calls R. Baley's comment "smart-ass" and encourages him/her to follow "the bouncing ball," he also encourages Baley to "make sense next time" (Both comments in diff).
  • Next 2 comments, R. Baley's reply is somewhat short, but indicates wish to drop until real AfD discussion. Bamadude's response. . .well just click. This response was something about 1st Ammendment rights and how R. Baley is almost "cool" beyond belief.
  • Next, Bamadude, re-factors his response in the discussion between R. Baley and himself. Bamadude "apologizes" for being "pissed" at R. Baley's "ignorance" (Or ignorance in general -presumably RB's- diff). and. . .
  • No longer "cool," R. Baley is now a "dolt" (Response to RB's note on the talk page that discussion had been re-factored (RB's refactor comment and BD's dolt comment both both here). Also noted: R. Baley might be a Republican!?

Summary Since the complaint at Wikiquette alerts (nothing to do with above diffs, those problems have to do with the Taxi talkpage), Cheeser1, has been handling almost everything (so far) him/herself. This situation is a time sink and shouldn't be shouldered by just one editor. I would have intervened more myself, but thought that my interaction would just inflame the situation (full disclosure: I did remove 1 section as inappropriate to the Taxi talk page here because I thought CF had had enough). I believe this situation should receive wider attention, so I'm bringing it here to ANI. I know it's long, but thanks for any consideration, R. Baley 09:02, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

The diffs given here are from last month and aren't really actionable. In theory the current conflict (over on Wikiquette alerts and the Taxi talk page) should be resolved now with the image deleted as a copyvio, Bamadude willing to concede that content dispute, and the personal attacks removed from User:Bamadude. – Steel 16:30, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Hi Steel, thanks for looking in to the current situation. I should have been more clear that my interaction was from the end of September, but I thought that it was significant in that it demonstrated a recurring problem. Btw, I agree with your declining to protect the page as premature (though I have some reservations about deleting the user page on principle due to the non-specific nature of the complaints/attacks). I thought his last gesture, wherein everybody accepts blame and drops all issues, was inadequate, and that the situation would be ongoing. My only request is that if the situation wrt the civility issues are not resolved, is that C1 and CF receive some community support. R. Baley 19:12, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Besides being extraordinarily confrontational, I think Bamadude has a problem understanding WP:V. He has repeatedly attacked other editors for removing or changing sources, asserting that WP:V requires the source to somehow be "easy" to verify (ie an online source or image, instead of a published secondary source like a book). He went so far as to upload a copyrighted source to Wikipedia for the purposes of proving himself right in a content dispute. When I was draw into the dispute, due to his uncivil behavior being reported on the WQA, I took immediate note of this fact and went about removing the images - blatant copyvio. And then he starts directing his inappropriate behavior at me. He also misunderstands WP:NPOV - he attacked me for not being "neutral" and "taking sides" in the WQA dispute - I don't know what that even means! It was a valid complaint against him. So I told him to be more civil. All in all, this user is seriously unpleasant, but alot of it seems to be a result of his poor understanding of policies. --Cheeser1 19:48, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

I also note that his ability to use a talk page is poor. He interrupts himself days later to add more stuff, and shoves it between older comments, jumps up and down the sections instead of presenting reasoned responses, and seems unable to let any part of a conversation die. It's not conducive to actually getting consensus, but reads (with diffculty) like he's desperate to continually fend off all comers. It made reading that talk page, as linked above, blinding, and I have to bounce up and down and after about 15 minutes, I just stopped trying. ThuranX 21:08, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

(general comment) I notice that he hasn't edited since I posted the ANI notice, which is atypical for him. I just wanted to say that it was not my intention to start a "pile-on" until he gives up editing altogether (if that is indeed the final outcome, hard to see the future is. . .). I really just wanted the condescending tone of his remarks to stop. The ideal outcome here is an acknowledgement/apology of the insulting nature of his past comments, and future editing where such comments aren't made (and BD being more receptive to collaboration and community feedback). I'm not sure how to make that happen, or if it's worth it. I am pretty sure that any appeal to BD made by me are likely to 'fall on deaf ears'. Thoughts? R. Baley 22:24, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

How to proceed will depend entirely on what happens when Bamadude arrives. – Steel 23:13, 14 October 2007 (UTC)


Resolved: No administrator attention needed. —bbatsell ¿? 19:43, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Keeps adding massive trivial information to The Grim Adventures of Billy & Mandy (video game)‎, and completely ignores WP:TRIVIA. Has also broken the 3RR rule. The Prince of Darkness 18:41, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

I have reverted their edit again, per WP:GAMEGUIDE, and they haven't re-added, they may have gone for now--Jac16888 19:06, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
This is a run-of-the-mill content dispute (and not even a good one). Not even close to a 3RR violation, and no attempts to discuss the changes on the talk page by either party. This does not involve administrators in any way. Take it to the talk page and read WP:3RR before making frivolous claims. Thanks. —bbatsell ¿? 19:43, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

vandalism in Turkish people article[edit]

Some people insert pseudo-scientific and nationalist statements into the article, without any reliable sources: [21] The problem was already discussed in Talk:Turkish people. I have once again removed the wrong and nationalist claims and restored the original version: [22] An admin should take a look at it and maybe protrect the page for a while. -- 21:33, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Vandalism should be reported on WP:AIV. One instance of vandalism a day is not reason for protection. EconomicsGuy 21:59, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
It's not only vandalism a day. This has been going on for months: [23] -- 23:08, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Actually it seems more like a content dispute to me, especially after reading the talk page as well. I will, however, admit that it seems like you guys are edit/revert warring and frankly it also seems like you are the one doing most of the reverting. Maybe it should be protected at the wrong version until a consensus is reached on the talk page. EconomicsGuy 00:08, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

What is Paste doing?[edit]

Paste (talk · contribs) is in the process of adding notability tags dated a month ago and afd templates to random articles about schools. I know this because I watch the article for St Winifred's Roman Catholic Primary School (those of British Christmas number 1 fame) and was about to comment to them that an afd for this article was unlikely to be successful, given the school's notability. However I think there may be something much bigger going on here, seeing as the same user appears to have taken offence at a school article they have created being nominated for deletion, and decided to alert the admins instead. I hope this was the right place to come. -- Roleplayer 21:33, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

If the St Winifred's one is anything to go by then all he's been doing is inserting the afd tag at the top of the page, but not completing the process. Of the long list of article's he's done it to none of them have shown up on the Oct 14th AfD log. I've deleted the St Winifred's tag as bad faith and uncompleted so the AfD discussion never started., but it looks like an admin will need to intervene for the other 41 school articles he's done it to. It looks like he's just gone through a template listing and tagged all of them. It looks like WP:POINT is getting a workout in this case. ---- WebHamster 22:46, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
The number of articles he or she has tagged without any discussion whatsoever is alarming. He or she is also tagging them incorrectly saying that they have been tagged since September when they were added today.
I also dropped him or her a line asking him or her to come here and explain what's going on. --ElKevbo 00:40, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Netmonger re-creating deleted box from MfD[edit]

I am reporting user Netmonger (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · edit filter log · block user · block log) for having re-created this userbox which was deleted on the recent MfD here. Previously, he has been blocked here for sending me harassing messages to my talk page and e-mail and was blocked again here for harassing me again and on similar charges. Twice his block was shortened on good faith under the conditions that he does not engage in such behavior again. However, it seems that he has not taken the blocking admins seriously. Therefore, I humbly request for this matter to be looked into. Thank you. Wiki Raja 21:37, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

It maybe of importance to note User Netmonger has a sockpuppet case opened here [24]. Sinhala freedom 22:07, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Sockpuppeting looks obvious and the disruption looks obvious. Should be blocked as such.--Crossmr 23:45, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Blocked indef. Refer to this thread below. -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 00:31, 15 October 2007 (UTC)


I have found a new sockpuppet. User: is obviously a sockpuppet of User:Polygamy4 and I am guessing that User:Big5Hunter is also a sock. His contributions, IP style, and writing style are evidence enough. See Wikipedia:Suspected sock puppets/Polygamy4 for information about him. His main accounts are currently blocked, as should these new socks. Dtm142 21:48, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

He was told he needed a different username. He's switched from polygamy to hunting. The IP is probably just him forgetting to login. The fellow seems a bit disoriented, but he isn't doing anything particularly horrible or disruptive, is he? If he is, diffs please. - Jehochman Talk 01:53, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
See the block logs of User:Polygamistx4 and a former IP. He also flamed Wikipedians and the ability to block here. He's been indefinitely blocked, so these new sockpuppets fall under block evasion. Dtm142 02:22, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
OK, I've indefed Big5Hunter because I agree that they are almost certainly the same person. Big5Hunter has been POV pushing [25] and made at least one horrific BLP violation. [26] That IP address is in Australia. I am wondering if it might be an open proxy. Reported to Wikipedia:WikiProject on open proxies for investigation. - Jehochman Talk 04:58, 15 October 2007 (UTC) (talk • contribs • deleted contribs • nuke contribs • logs • filter log • block user • block log)[edit]


He continues to vandalize the article Frank de Jong. J 23:32, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Please refer to WP:AIV for prompt actions next time. -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 23:36, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Blocked IP 24 hours for egregious vandalism. - Jehochman Talk 23:43, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Pornography in the sandbox[edit]

Resolved (talk · contribs) has been posting porography in the sandbox quite a bit latley. See contribs. Cheers,JetLover (Report a mistake) 00:33, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Blocked by FayssalF. —Cryptic 00:48, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Lustful anon with a dynamic IP[edit]

As you can see a few cases above, an anon was posting porn in the sandbox. He has come back to vandalize my userpage and post more porn. Cheers,JetLover (Report a mistake) 01:14, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Looks like the user has been blocked. See (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · filter log · WHOIS · RDNS · RBLs · http · block user · block log). --B 01:20, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Martial arts and administration[edit]

It has been suggested that I need a nice roundhouse kick to the skull for some of the administration tasks I've done lately. Apparently, I was supposed to block someone indefinitely for a faulty sockpuppet report. Since I didn't do so, and since I decided to call the reporting user's edits into question, I'm supposed to receive a roundhouse kick to the head, and I'm supposed to apologize afterwards.

Here's my question: If I've been knocked to the floor by a roundhouse kick, how long would it take me to recover from the injuries before I could apologize to Tyler Warren (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · page moves · block user · block log)? Does a roundhouse kick often cause a concussion? Are there any other admins who have been the unfortunate recipient of a roundhouse kick and who have apologized as a result? --Elkman (Elkspeak) 03:56, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

I have requested that User:Tyler Warren retract the statement. And I will indef block him until such time as the statement is retracted. I suggest he be given a short amount of time to comply (say 12 hours) until the expiry of his current block to comply. -- Flyguy649 talk 04:00, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
It should be noted that he is already blocked until October 18. But of course if he doesn't retract the comment by then, an indef would be appropriate. --B 04:38, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Vandalism fad on GameFAQs[edit]

It appears as though GameFAQs' Super Smash Bros. Brawl board has taken vandalizing Wikipedia to be a fad. Look, for instance, at these edits to Charizard which correspond to this GameFAQs thread. Also have a look at these edits to List of EarthBound characters#Ness, which correspond to [27] this GameFAQs topic. I'm not sure where else they have stricken, but the Ness thread refers to it as a fad. Is there anything that can be done about this? You Can't See Me! 04:42, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

I can keep an eye on the SSB:B board, but not much else. If there were a GameFAQs moderator who was a user here that would make things easier. Wizardman 04:46, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
I've blocked User:HawkofPrey which appears to be a vandal-only account which is part of this effort. Will continue to monitor as well. CitiCat 05:13, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

User:Jeffrey O. Gustafson[edit]


I severely wonder about this admin's sanity. He has just deleted images from my user page without prior notice. This is not the first time he's done this, and there is a history here. I'll accept policy if it's explained, but not if it's done maliciously. Caution is OK, malice and bad faith are not. If this is not the appropriate forum, please advise, and I'll take it to where it belongs. --Rodhullandemu (talk - contribs) 03:29, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

You cannot place non-free use images in userspace. ≈ jossi ≈ (talk) 03:33, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
I severely wonder about MY OWN sanity! MessedRocker (talk) 03:36, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Jossi, I don't think Rodhullandemu posted here looking for an explanation as to why the images were deleted (it's already been explained to him). I think he's complaining aboutwhat he sees as a lack of communication/courtesy on the admin's part.--The Fat Man Who Never Came Back 03:48, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
No, the user seems to think the removal of the images was in retaliation for an odd message he left me. See this. --Jeffrey O. Gustafson - Shazaam! - <*> 03:54, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Well, discussion can never hurt, as evidenced here. ^_^;; --Iamunknown 05:08, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Nods, fair use for full copyrighted images doesn't cover userspace. DurovaCharge! 05:51, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Endorse deletion, clearly. Fair use galleries in userspace is a speedy deletion criterion, so no discussion or assent is needed. Daniel 10:58, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Endorse but note that posting a note up-front can be useful to reassure and explain in a number of cases; non-communication is a common source of resentment, suspicion, and bad faith and as can be seen it ended up taking an explanation anyhow. FT2 (Talk | email) 22:08, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

I would advise you to read this for more information about the use of fair use images in userspace. Melsaran (talk) 13:44, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Sockpuppetry by User:Taprobanus[edit]

Sumoeagle179 (talk · contribs), who I have never had any contact with on Wikipedia in the past, has filed a sock puppet case accusing practically everyone who edits Sri Lanka related articles as been a sockpuppet of Lahiru k, including me. He has demonstrated an extensive knowledge of happenings related Sri Lankan articles, referencing edits that happened last year, even though he has never edited any of the articles he mentions. This led me to doubt the authenticity of this account.

Reading the SSP case he filed, it becomes pretty obvious as to whom the actual owner of the account is. In one place of the case he says,

"User:Iwazaki began to follow me around in my edits [[28]] and [[29] these are couple of examples only."

He directly says Iwazaki followed him (i.e. Sumoeagle179) around, and linked to two past versions of two articles as proof. What he linked to were

  • The 12:19, January 6, 2007 revision of the Padahuthurai bombing article, after Iwazaki made his first edit to the page. Up to that time the only other editor of the article was Taprobanus, who had created the article a few hours before. If Iwazaki did following someone's edits to find the article, it could only have been Taprobanus.
  • The 01:16, January 7, 2007 revision of the Mylanthanai massacre, after Iwazaki's second edit to the article. Upto then, the only other editors to the article were Lahiru k, who Sumoeagle179 is accusing Iwazaki of being a sockpuppet of, and, Taprobanus, who created the article a few days before.

In both instances, the only editor who Iwazaki could have been accused of stalking was Taprobanus, and the account Sumoeagle179 has zero contributions to any of those articles, so when he says "User:Iwazaki began to follow me around in my edits" it seems obvious he actually meant Iwazaki was following his other account Taprobanus (talk · contribs) around. --snowolfD4 ( talk / @ ) 22:04, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

User snowolfd4 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · edit filter log · block user · block log) who is accused of sock puppetry, has chosen to delete the tag placed on his page [30], without any recent checkuser evidence for or against the case. Just looking at what snowolfd4 is talking about, Sumoefagle merely appended his comment to an existing report that was launched by Taprobanus a long while ago, hence the mix up. This seems to be the original case filed [31]. If you look carefully at the report [32], sumofeagle has added a label to indicate it was text from the previous report. Sinhala freedom 22:17, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
From what I can see at first sight, the passage picked out by Snowolfd4 as incriminating is not really something Sumoeagle is saying about himself; he is quoting an earlier SSP report that was indeed filed by Taprobanus, and in whose context those sentences make sense. So, forget about that part. I haven't looked into the rest of this affair yet, but I'm getting the impression that we need bans all round, for several people on both sides of this conflict, and sooner rather than later. Fut.Perf. 22:28, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Nowhere has he said he was pasting Taprobanus's comments to the case. It also doesn't not explain how an account which has been completely uninvolved in the articles mentioned (in the rest of his case) suddenly got such extensive knowledge about them. Becuase I can't emphasize this enough, Sumoeagle179 has never edited any of the articles he mentioned, and has never been involved with the editors he has filed the case against. --snowolfD4 ( talk / @ ) 22:46, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
This looks like yet another chapter in the machinations of Sri Lankan civil war conflict. I support topic bans for a number of the involved users, since they've turned this encyclopedia into an all out battlefield. The report Snowolf discusses here might have merit, but I don't think the posited quotes show that he's a sockpuppet of the user who is being accused. However, he definitely looks suspicious. Look at the other reports on this board for yet more examples of the kind of tit-for-tat reportism that goes on over this topic. It's way, way too complicated for anyone to cleanly sort out, and short of blocking and banning users from Sri Lanka related topics we're not going to get any closure here. Most users are simply not interested in cooling off the conflict, and instead are engaged in a kind of editorial brinksmanship to see if they can goad, cajole, canvassing, and accuse each other into getting blocked. --Haemo 23:08, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Yep, absolutely. Fut.Perf. 23:14, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Ditto. It is really tiresome and harsh measures should be taken. There's no other way to deal w/ this mess. I have to add that Snowolfd4 can refer to WP:RFCU using the "G" code as this is not the appropriate place for us to verify sockpuppetry. -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 23:15, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
I'd send them all straight to Arbcom, if it wasn't for the fact that Arbcom is currently bogged down to the point of having become completely dysfunctional. We'd probably get a resolution only in two or three months time, if at all. I guess we'd better sort this out at the community level. Fut.Perf. 23:18, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
True. Usually, most sockpuppets are created and more disruption and edit warring happen during ArbCom hearings. Here you get the third admin to suggest topic bans for the few edit warriors. -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 23:25, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
If we're going to start taking action, I think this is clear-cut enough to be definitive. Is a checkuser necessary, or do we have enough information to move? --Haemo 23:41, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
So User:Lahiru_k is User:Mystìc is User: is User:Netmonger. And allllllllllllllllll of those accounts relate to User:Snsudharsan, User:Psivapalan, User:Sri119, User:Mama007 and User:Ajgoonewardene.
Ok, Lahiru K has just left wikipedia for abusing editing privileges by using multiple accounts for more than a year now. Whose next? -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 23:56, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
And netmonger ? Watchdogb 00:04, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
He's also left this place. -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 00:11, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Snowolf4 and Iwazaki have removed their sock tags here and here. I can see where Snowolf4 may not be a sockpuppett of Lahiru_k, but he could still be a meatpuppett. I still think Kaushini is a sockpupptt of Lahiru-u. See the SSP case for details. And yes, the quote was a paste from the first SSP case earlier this year, I wasn't talking to Snowolf4 or anyone else. I agree this whole Sri lankan civil war case should go to the community board for review. Sumoeagle179 00:47, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

It also looks definitive that User:Kaushini is a sockpuppet of User:Lahiru k, based on the evidence gathered, and these two diffs. I'm indef blocking User:Kaushini as well. --Haemo 01:26, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
This is the abuse of administrative privileges at it's most ridiculous. So much for your promise earlier to keep neutral in these matters, Haemo. I'm already discussing with FayssalF about his antics.
About User:Kaushini, do you know what Gateway, the ISP is? It's an education institution in Sri Lanka. The two edits are you use as proof are edits by the IP from September 1, 2006 (by Kaushini) and May 21, 2007 (by Lahiru). That is the ONLY proof you have that the two users are the same. Further, that IP has made tons of edits before either Lahiru and Kaushini started editing Wikipedia. Do you think you are going to get away with blocking everyone who edits Wikipedia from Gateway as a sockpuppet?
So I suggest you unblock User:Kaushini and seriously consider your biases in editing Wikipedia before this goes any further, where the fact that you are admins has little relevance. --snowolfD4 ( talk / @ ) 02:08, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
So, it's just a whopping coincidence that all three share IP? I don't think so. This is 100% coincident with a single user having a "home IP" and a "school IP", which he uses to sockpuppet with. --Haemo 02:25, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
Okay, now put your money where your mouth is and prove Netmonger used the IP --snowolfD4 ( talk / @ ) 02:30, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
Did I say that? No, I didn't. I'm asserting that the circumstances are that Netmonger, Mystic, and Laihru all edited from the same personal IP. Laihru and Kaushini edited from the same school IP address. The story this is telling me is that Laihru, a known sockpuppeteer, used his home address to run one set of sockpuppets, and a school IP to run the other sets. We've seen it before, and we'll see it again. --Haemo 02:33, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
You can add to this that said school IP address has fewer than 50 edits total, of which many relate to Sri Lanka and Sri Lankan topics. --Haemo 02:38, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
An IP from a Sri Lankan school edited articles about Sri Lanka? How surprising? --snowolfD4 ( talk / @ ) 02:41, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
Your assumptions of bad faith in this case are astounding. Are you saying that only one person could have ever edited Wikipedia from the Gateway school? What other proof do you have that Lahiru is the same as Kaushini? --snowolfD4 ( talk / @ ) 02:39, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
I'm saying that a duck is a duck. This IP address has a handful of contributions — in fact, fewer than 40. In four of them (10%) the IP is acting as Kaushini around September 2006. In an earlier the same year the IP works on an article Laihru created only 3 hours ago. In early 2007, the IP acts as Laihru, this time signing for him. In the meantime, it occasionally edits Wikipedia showing a pro-Sri Lankan opinion, familiarity with many "advanced" user abilities. The concept that this IP, with only a handful of edits just-so happened to be used by a known sockpuppeteer and then another unrelated user in exactly the same topic area, with similar opinions is beyond coincidence. Sri Lanka is not that small. --Haemo 02:51, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
All you are doing is admitting that all you have is your speculation on your part. Two editors go to the same school, and they are sockpuppets? That's ridiculous. So answer this. Why has he not used it since November last year?
Sri Lanka is not that small? EXACTLY. There could be more that one person in the same school editing Wikipedia. How hard is it for you to get that into your mind? --snowolfD4 ( talk / @ ) 03:17, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
Summarizing the evidence as you just did is disingenuous and incorrect. In the anonymous world of internet communication, this is the most solid evidence we can get. Even a positive checkuser could only confirm that they used the same IP addresses; something we have already confirmed. The standard here is beyond a reasonable doubt; I think that is clearly established in this case. The odds that from a purportedly public terminal there would be only 30-odd edits, of which a good third are from two supposedly different users, who edit in identical subject areas, with similar points of view are very, very low — especially when one of those users has already been determined to use sockpuppets to support his point of view. --Haemo 03:36, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
Please explain to me why then there is a 5 month break in this IP? If this is used by a school and people usually edit wikipedia from there, then why is there a 5 month break in this IP adress. What happened there ? Watchdogb 03:23, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
To further add to Haemo take a look here [33] where Lahir created the article and then the IP edits it. To make thinks more clear, lahiru also does the same edit as the IP did, namely adding the Inter wiki link. Lahiru adds the inter wiki link just like the IP does Watchdogb 03:06, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
Also take a look at this. Again the same IP makes an edit in between Lahiru's edits but not at the same time (days in difference). Taking a closer look at the IP edit it amazingly knows what Lahiru meant when he talked about American MOH. It's a clear cut case of sock puppet usage. Watchdogb 03:13, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Okay, thanks guys for doing the sock blocks. This leaves us with the rest of the Sri Lankan problem: two factions of editors who seem to be doing little else but fighting each other. Who's left? User:Wiki Raja, User:Iwazaki, User:Taprobanus, User:Snowolfd4, User:Watchdogb, anybody else? I don't doubt some or all of these may be good-faith and potentially productive contributors, but with all their fighting, their net effect on the project is negative. Should we consider topic bans? Fut.Perf. 06:14, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

The blocks of those couple sock accounts may have an effect on how the rest of editors would behave starting today. I suggest we would keep an eye and any further violation of any kind would result in a topic ban. -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 09:53, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
Insulting and funny comment made about my account. However, I will assume good faith. Anyways, since fut and Fay are inclined to make the editors cease edit war I sure hope you will find some time giving third opinions. Specially because RFC is another slow process that might not help until edit war is over via a locked article. Watchdogb 13:26, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
I woke up today in Sunny Canada to find out that I have been accused of being a sock puppet. Well now that things have cooled down and unfortunately my good net friend who ever operated Lahiru_K account is banned, I want to make it clear that I have shown my good faith to cease edit warring by being one of original founders of Sri Lankan reconciliation project. Our intention was to find compromise using wiki rules instead of fighting it out. Alas like all attempts at reconciliation, this attempt too seems to have failed in this case. I hope more Sri Lanka centric editors would become members of it and discuss differences of opinion and resolve them without distracting the entire community. Just a few admins seems to have resolved this problem with bold action. Kudos to them. I just hope someone like this will resolve the real Sri Lankan civil war in Sri Lanka.:))) Thanks Taprobanus 15:09, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

User:Rubbersoul20 - Persistent harassment/uncivility, OR, POV, {fact} removal[edit]

For three months, Rubbersoul20 (talk · contribs) has been edit-warring on Latin American literature for adding unsourced/OR/POV/weasel, then when it was reluctantly accepted but tagged {fact} or {refimprove}, he just kept on deleting the tags. It's not content dispute since he just doesn't follow basic policy and guidelines.

His talk page shows he's blanked his talk page after a block for harassment and a vandalism warning, and has been moving AFD tags too, so that's a habit. Another user tried to discuss with him on his talk page and the article's talk page, but he just got told he was a penis with a piped link to the graphic picture.

Self-involvement: I am actually a recent contributor to this article, and after today's new revert war I noticed with horror how this had been going on for months in the article history. Except for one resistant, the other contributors that could been seen in the history before August 2007 have all left the building... — Komusou talk @ 08:31, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Well, I warned him about the user talk conduct (which he followed by blanking) but I'll leave the article edits for another day someone else. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 08:45, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Protection for review[edit]

I've IAR'd semiprotecting Turkic peoples against the persistent attacks of an anonymous IP user who insists on introducing an image propagating the nationalist organisation Grey Wolves, against clear consensus of several other users. The IP never discusses, never gives reasons in edit summaries, just reverts blindly. His only talk contributions have been nationalist insults. I've protected even though I was previously involved in the reverting; therefore bringing it here for review. Fut.Perf. 09:13, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Hmmm, it's a tough one as this wasn't vandalism, it was a content dispute and by semi protecting the article, you have allowed autoconfirmed users to win the edit war. I would have preferred to see more discussion with the IP's in question as there's seems to be very little so far. Perhaps a report to WP:AN/3RR would have been better (I know it hasn't really broken 3RR, but it had over a number of days). I just don't like the idea of semi protecting to win an edit war. Ryan Postlethwaite 09:59, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
I accept your point in principle, but in this case it had become abundantly clear the anon was not a legitimate contributor. This was going on for over three weeks, and the only contribution of the anon to the talk page was this: [40], (besides [[41], ], just today), plus abusive summaries like these [42], [43] ('go f**k your mother'), [44] ('you idiot, you don't have the power to remove the Grey Wolves, give it up') Of course an AN3 report could have resulted in a block, but since he's a dynamic IP and almost certainly willing to dodge our rules, that wouldn't have stopped him and semiprotection would again have been the only solution. -- In the meantime, another admin has replaced my "involved" protection with his "uninvolved" one, I see. Fut.Perf. 10:24, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
I'd have just warned the IP for using innapropriate edit summaries thus reminding them to be civil and asking them to use the talk page before blocking if they don't listen. -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 10:28, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
There had in fact been ample warnings of that kind, to which the only response, as I now see, was this. I feel my only mistake here has been that I tried to engage this guy as a good-faith editor yesterday, entering into a dispute with him in the belief that this might be possible. If I'd been fully aware of the previous history, I'd have simply intervened as an uninvolved admin from the outset (because that's what I was until that moment), and I could have legitimately blocked/protected in whatever way necessary. Fut.Perf. 10:37, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
Ohh! and the warning (i'd say the requests) to use the talk page resulted in incivility. Well, then i totally support the semi-protection especially that the IP is dynamic. -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 10:44, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Over-zealous vandal-fighter[edit]

We have acquired an energetic new vandal-fighter in the form of User:TheUNOFFICIALvandalpolice (formerly User:TheVandalPolice). However, their edit comments and comments to reverted editors are over-zealous in the extreme. Several other editors have asked them to moderate their comments, to no avail. I'm beginning to think that if they continue like this, they may become more part of the problem (particularly relating to WP:BITE) than part of the solution. -- Karada 10:46, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Let the cop stay in the office for a while before getting out to the streets. -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 10:55, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
I still think it's a username violation personally, but I also agree his vandal fighting skills aren't really on. I've just warned him about it and if he continues as he has been, it is unfortunate that I may have to block him to stop this. Ryan Postlethwaite 10:59, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
His/her contribution is helpful, but the way (s)he is doing is like engaging the war. Per WP:INSULT, I think (s)he needs to cool down for a few hours until (s)he can manage to unlock the CAPS-LOCK button and reading through WP:VANDAL policies. — Indon (reply) — 10:59, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
Yes and that's why i showed them how our Can't sleep, clown will eat me works. -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 11:01, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
I think that the user's opposition to vandalism is admirable but their methods leave much to be desired. Most vandalism on Wikipedia is a juvenile prank and stops when another user drops by to say "Don't do that". Giving an angry and aggressive message (whether in all caps or not) is more likely to encourage a fighting response, and may therefore aggravate the vandalism and not control it. Sam Blacketer 11:04, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
  • I've advised him on a different method he could adopt when reverting vandalism, hopefully he will change his ways and maybe become a valued vandal fighter. Ryan Postlethwaite 11:08, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
  • All I've got to say is, when you think you've seen everything. I hope he calms down because I can't imagine having to stop someone for being too aggressive with vandals. That's a new one for sure. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 11:16, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Unbelievable, we beat bodies go down and get our hands dirty while the top brass sits around twiddling their thumbs thinking up new reasons on why we should be nice to vandals.

With respect to WP:BITE, I try to ensure that any user I warn was clearly vandalising, example posting a chat log over an article, example saying that wind farms operated off “human gas”. These people are not newbies making a simple mistake, they are hardened vandals who want to undermine the integrity of wikipedia.

With respect to WP:Vandal I am well aware of what constitutes vandalism and if anyone can point out where I labelled an edit as being when it wasn’t then I will happily retract any criticism and make a personal apology to the editor.

With respect to WP:Insult, this is an essay filled with original research. The fact that a number of the users I have reverted and/or warned have not continued to vandalise just shows that taking a hard stance against those who wish to disrupt the project.

With respect to people making excusing for vandals in claiming I was “baiting” them, please read above and consider that if I was out to cause harm to the project there are easier ways to do it.

With respect to the templates they remove the personal force that accompanies the messages and often they fail to cut to the chase (saying a person was only testing when it is clear they knew they were vandalising).

With respect to other vandal fighters, I acknowledge that they have their ways of doing things but this is by no means a tried and tested method. The continuing influx of vandals just goes to show that a more authoritative stance is required.

With respect to people who don’t like my caps lock please see that I only use it against the scum vandals in order to make it clear we do not appreciate their edits.

With respect to people who don’t like my username, I make it quite clear (with capital letters) that I am the unofficial vandal police and that I have a disclaimer on my main user page.

I must say I am quite shocked to see some established editors supporting the plight of vandalism. We must not bow down to the beliefs that people vandalise wikipedia because they had a bad childhood or because they couldn’t afford the latest computer game, we must continue to take a hard stance against those who seek to add misinformation and remove valid facts and undermine the integrity of the project.

That said my shift is almost finished, I’ve been editing under IP addresses and two accounts. Hopefully the guys who patrol the next beat will continue to take a hard stance against vandalism without excessive interference from the upper brass.

the UNOFFICIAL vandal policeBang Bang 11:26, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Okay I really think you need to calm down. You are not a police officer, no administrator is. Even if you were, the job of a police officer is to talk not shout. We don't work in police shifts, wikipedia isn't a beat, and there is no upper brass. Admins are vandal fighters are just volunteers who preen the more unwanted aspects of wikipedia and try to keep it readable and useful to everyone as a resource or information. You might want to adjust your attitude slightly, as you come across as very provocative, attacking and insulting to some people. Calling vandals "scum" isn't acceptable now is it? SGGH speak! 11:32, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
I do everything in my power to remain civil towards regular editors who wish to make genuine contributions to the encyclopedia. Vandals on the other hand are not deserving of the same respect, as they seek only to disrupt and add vulgar information in the hope of amusing their friends. As far as I’m concerned, and I think many editors will agree with me, editors who knowingly vandalise are scum, and I see no problem with calling it as it is. As for being “insulting” towards these vandals, keeping in mind that I will only call vandalism where it is true vandalism then quite frankly if they find the hard line stance insulting and go somewhere else then the best situation has come about. the UNOFFICIAL vandal policeBang Bang 11:47, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for your comments. Please understand that appreciate your efforts against vandalism, and we're just trying to help you be more effective by denying attention to vandals and not biting the newbies. Please help us by modulating the tone of your remarks to other users, per WP:CIVIL, and you'll find that you will rapidly become a welcome member of the team. It would be a great shame if you got blocked for over-zealousness. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Karada (talkcontribs) 11:34, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
Thankyou, but I believe taking a hard line stance against vandalism is better than worrying about the feelings of the perpetrators. You can be assured that I will only call vandalism where it actually exits, and in my mind WP:CIVIL does not apply in its fullest extent to those who wish to undermine the integrity of the encyclopedia, if they run away because they feel insulted then all the better for us. the UNOFFICIAL vandal policeBang Bang 11:47, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
You can be right but i believe that most admins who approached you and gave you advices have more experience w/ vandalism than you have. So please listen to them as your efforts are positive and needed but not the way you do it. Would it be hard for you to turn off your CAPS, avoid insults and still be more effective w/ your tasks? -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 11:56, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
Let's try another police analogy. If someone is stopped for a traffic infraction, is the officer not resolutely polite, calm, and professional, even in the face of abuse? The goal is de-escalation, not fuelling the fire. A degree of bland detachment almost always works better than rage. Acroterion (talk) 12:01, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
Out of the tens of thousands of things that annoy me about Wikipedia, vandalism probably tops the list. Warning a user and discussing possible blocks for his or her attempts to combat this problem are...well, let's just say it's typical of the Wikipedian mentality and leave it at that. But I will say I am glad that this user is trying to make the encyclopedia easier to edit for constructive users. Until Wikipedia changes its policies and restricts editing to only registered users, I think we should support anyone who tries to stop vandals (but that human gas wind farm edit was kind of funny :-D ). Jeffpw 12:07, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
We all support what he is doing but we don't support the way he does it. The outcome could be the same whether he uses CAPS, harsh edit summaries or not. He is a newbie and we are giving him advices but it seems that he is arguing too much about something which he can do better. WP:CIVIL applies also when fighting vandalism. -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 12:14, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
I am not going to add to the policeman analogies, as you are not a policeman, those whose edits you revert are not criminals, the admins and other editors here are not "top brass" and you are not a hardworking flatfoot fighting to do your job despite the efforts of PC deskbound jonnies who don't understand your effective yet unorthadox methods of policing.... Instead this is an online encyclopedia created and edited by volunteers...
You say "You can be assured that I will only call vandalism where it actually exits, and in my mind WP:CIVIL does not apply in its fullest extent to those who wish to undermine the integrity of the encyclopedia, if they run away because they feel insulted then all the better for us." However, if you look on your talkpage you have already admitted one of the vandal "scum" you warn was nor actually a vandal. [45] Your incivility there was therefore completely unwarranted even by your own standards. I wouls suggest that you listen to the advice that has been offered to you. •CHILLDOUBT• 12:09, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
Did this editor just admit to sockpuppeting? See comment above, "I’ve been editing under IP addresses and two accounts." The name is a problem. It conveys (correctly in this case) a loose cannon, vigilante attitude. Putting myself in the shoes of a newbie user who needs to learn the ropes, I would resent and not heed anyone who calls themselves "vandal police" and presumes to school me on the rules of Wikipedia. The defiant tone adopted towards more experienced editors here troubles me. We ought to be reasonably mature and professional, and not go about things with a chip on the shoulder. This whole things casts us in a bad light.