User talk:Huon

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to navigation Jump to search
Talk page archives

Convent & Stuart Hall[edit]

You just deleted Convent & Stuart Hall under G12. I don't know if you noticed the multiple name changes earlier in the day, all now chaos. If it was a copyvio, that's fine. I had nothing to do with that. The subject(s) deserve an article. I will recreate the article with just superficial information rewritten from the source you credited (otherwise I know nothing of the subject other than that it exists). I will also re-establish the necessary redirects. Please do not delete the new article as a reflex. Trackinfo (talk) 05:17, 3 April 2019 (UTC)

Trackinfo, you can find context on the copyright issue here. I tried to excise the copy-pasted parts that were added in the recent "merger" and had to find that the article's older revisions were still largely copy-pasted from elsewhere. Basically all the prose was tainted. I have no objections to the creation of a new, clean article, and I don't think any admin would "reflexively" delete the re-creation of something deleted for copyright issues without checking whether the new version still has the copyright issues. Huon (talk) 09:38, 3 April 2019 (UTC)
Thank you. A lot of people DO delete reflexively. We don't need to fight, but this causes problems. I did recreate a very flimsy article. Since there were interested parties earlier in the day, I hope it will serve as low hanging fruit to get improved. Trackinfo (talk) 19:57, 3 April 2019 (UTC)
Chiming in as well. I am the one who created the redirects and mergers for the other articles into this article. I am also an agent of this organization and have disclosed this on my user page. Perhaps I am misunderstanding, but the mergers should stay as they more accurately reflect the organization of the school — a single school (Convent & Stuart Hall) with 4-divisions (Convent Elementary, Stuart Hall for Boys, Convent High School, and Stuart Hall High School). I will work (harder) on creating neutral and factually correct content, and am wondering if it is appropriate to cite the school's website as a source of content (i.e. student body, faculty & staff, endowment, etc...)Sacredsf (talk) 19:27, 5 April 2019 (UTC)
The school's website is a primary source; it can be used, but with care, and it shouldn't be used too much. For example (with numbers I just made up), saying "the school has 123 students and 45 teachers" would probably be OK with the school's website as a source, but adding, "giving it an exceptionally low student-to-teacher ratio" would be inappropriate, even if the school's website explicitly makes such a claim. Huon (talk) 20:40, 5 April 2019 (UTC)

Copyvio unblock[edit]

Copyvio by Raianick95 (>95% earwig). This edotor has not edited in nearly two years since you unblocked on appeal [1], but evidently did not clean up the copyvios left. The editor even claimed the copyvio above as own work in edit summary. Judging the speed of the edits, I suspect that the editor was either an undeclared paid editor, or writing blurbs for free. I could try on my own to clean up, but I do not have much experience handling copyvios, and need advice. Thanks. Neonorange (Phil) 00:09, 6 April 2019 (UTC)

@Neonorange: Thanks for letting me know; I reverted the text to an older version and deleted the infringing revisions. I think that was likely the only remaining problem; all other articles that I just checked had already been cleaned up. Huon (talk) 21:29, 6 April 2019 (UTC)
Thank you for the follow-up and reply! Next time I'll try to do more checking before handing off the kettle of fish. I came across By the Rivers of Babylon after hearing a collaborative performance by Linda Rondstadt of Rivers of Babylon on Hasten Down the Wind (1976)—turning to Wikipedia for more information and reaching the book article—turning to Google, and finding dozens of covers (of the Rastafari original based on Psalm 137.) I was drawn back to the book article because of the tag that asserted 'written too much like a blurb'—my thought was, well, that's 'cause it is a blurb, and quickly found prior instances of the blurb. (Is'nt Wikipedia Wonderful!) — Neonorange (Phil) 22:09, 6 April 2019 (UTC)


Should I be too worried about that matter? I don't feel like I should be, but.... 331dot (talk) 17:44, 6 April 2019 (UTC)

(talk page stalker) I wouldn't be. Just RD/OS the legal threat and send 'em to legal. Praxidicae (talk) 18:34, 6 April 2019 (UTC)
I'm not an oversighter, but I don't see that this meets any of the criteria for oversight. One could argue that it meets the "grossly inappropriate threats or attacks" part of WP:RD3, but personally I don't see that, either. 331dot, regarding "worried", I expect Interpol has better things to do than make life difficult for alleged ... whatever your supposed crime might be. Libel it can't be, since you didn't do that. I rather doubt blocking people who violate Wikipedia's policies (and, by extension, the Terms of Use) violates any Indian law. Huon (talk) 21:29, 6 April 2019 (UTC)

Aggregate (Historical Rankings of US Presidents)[edit]

Hey, I skimmed the argument against the aggregate. I agree with the argument of deleting it, but I feel as though the historical rankings should still be listed on the page, as it is still useful information. Apologies for the mistake. New to Wikipedia editting SweQwop. SweQwop (talk) 03:27, 18 April 2019 (UTC)

@SweQwop: The rankings are still listed on the page. I only removed the "aggregate" column which followed some editor's self-made methodology of aggregation. Huon (talk) 10:29, 18 April 2019 (UTC)

Regarding my article I created on Kamini Dube[edit]

Hey Huon,

Thanks for reviewing my article. and leting me know that wikipedia cannot be used as a cite.

it would be helpful if you could let me know which citations exactly I need to change. please let me know my mistakes so that I can edit the article better.

please have a look and let me know .

Thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by Callmesiddie (talkcontribs) 00:55, 30 April 2019 (UTC)

@Callmesiddie: Curb Safe Charmer cut out the worst content here. That was a mix of puffery, vacuous claims, and outright falsehoods. Regarding the sources, what Bollywood Hungama writes about Dube reads likea hagiography, calling the independence of that source into question. That sounds like some rehashed press release, not like an independent news report. The articles by the BBC, by Empowering India, by the Financial Express and by Rediff don't mention Dube at all and are useless as sources for a Wikipedia article about her. The Daily Hunt piece is aggregated content not under their editorial control (and reproduces the same hagiographic content about her as Bollywood Hungama, further establishing that that's not something written by Bollywood Hungama news staff). Finally, Cinando indicates that the lone film Dube (co-)produced is something of a family venture, and it misrepresents Bombay Talkies' history by implying that the Dube family had a leading role in the studio of the same name that closed in 1954. That's not a reliable source, and it seems likely that the content was supplied by the filmmakers, ie by Dube and her associates. So in short, all of the citations would need to be changed. How are you associated with Dube? Huon (talk) 19:10, 30 April 2019 (UTC)

hey Huon,

Good to hear from you, I understood your point, I just want to understand when would my article be eligible for a wiki article? I mean what all do I need? Also I am a resident of Madh Island, Malad West Mumbai and Dube's Rashtraputra had been very famous among our people, also they are popular here, Her father in law is an ex MLC and her brother in law has received 'President Award' and has been doing a great job here. And when I researched more about Rashtraputra I came to know there wasn't any article mentioning her so I came up with my researches and made an article on her. Also I am not familiar of this thing you told me about 'Bombay Talkies' that shut down in 1954, Can u please let me know what that issue is? Might be I can help you with this being a local resident.

Thanks please revert @huon Callmesiddie (talk) 16:29, 3 May 2019 (UTC)

@Callmesiddie: The source you removed here says: "[...] The Bombay Talkies Studios made a splendid comeback with the film Rashtraputra. The company was established by Rajnarayan Dube in 1934." As far as I can tell that's false; our article (and the reliable published sources it's based on) mentions the roles of Himanshu Rai and Devika Rani in Bombay Talkies, but Dube is conspiciously absent from the historical record. A Google Books search finds some mentions of Dube in connection with Bombay Talkies, but very few (four, to be precise, including at least one self-published one), and only from 2014 onward. There are dozens, possibly hundreds, of books that discuss this studio; are we to believe that they all missed Dube's role? Or is it more likely that all those works crediting Himansu Rai are correct and Dube was not the person who established that studio, and that the Cinando piece, clearly written by the Dubes, claims an inappropriately large role for their ancestor to lend more glamour to their current venture? I'm going with the latter. And if the Dubes fake that, what else have they faked?
Being a local resident won't be of much help. Wikipedia content must be a summary of what reliable third-party sources have reported about the subject, and such sources seem to be scarce. Huon (talk) 17:36, 3 May 2019 (UTC)

Hey Huon,

Glad to hear from you, and I went through the article link you provided. But my research lead me towards the conclusion that the bombay talkies they spoke about is actually The Bombay Talkies Ltd. and also there is mentioned in a citation that Rai was supported by some business institutions and that was Rajnarayan Dube, son of renowned Seth Badriprasad Dube, as per I could predict, making films wasn't considered to be a noble cause that time and due to which it might not be mentioned there as the shareholder. And Rajnarayan Dube was a shareholder in The Bombay Talkies Ltd. while he owned The Bombay Talkies Studios, The Bombay Talkies Laboratory and The Bombay Talkies Pictures which isn't mentioned anywhere in your article. There might be a big misconception regarding 'The Bombay Talkies Studios' and 'Bombay Talkies'. Also I would like to let u know that 'bombay talkies' never existed, it was a common name given to The Bombay Talkies Ltd., The Bombay Talkies Studios, Bombay Talkies Pictures and Bombay Talkies Laboratories. I have seen the credits of 'The Bombay Talkies Studios' where it is clearly stated as 'The Bombay Talkies Ltd presents' and 'Produced and Processed at The Bombay Talkies Studios', which states they are two different companies and I guess I have made myself clear, All I want to say is that Himanshu Rai and Devika Rani together with Rajnarayan Dube formed 'bombay talkies' a common name for the four companies, 'The Bombay Talkies Ltd.', 'Bombay Talkies Laboratories', 'The Bombay Talkies Studios' and 'Bombay Talkies Pictures'.

You must also have a look at the old posters of the movies, everywhere it is mentioned about the three different companies 'The Bombay Talkies Ltd.' Bombay Talkies Pictures and The Bombay Talkies Studios'. Callmesiddie (talk) 23:16, 3 May 2019 (UTC)

I didn't look for a connection between Rajnarayan Dube and any particular corporate entity. I searched Google Books for "Rajnarayan Dube" and "Bombay Talkies", which should have found any of "The Bombay Talkies Ltd.", "Bombay Talkies Laboratories", "The Bombay Talkies Studios" and "Bombay Talkies Pictures". Except it didn't find anything predating 2014, and very, very little after that (and some of that wasn't reliable). Bombay Talkies, however, is not the main issue. The main issue is that there are no reliable third-party sources covering Kamini Dube in any appreciable detail. Google news gives few results; the Bollywood Hungama one is the one already discussed above. The Hindustan Times and Free Press Journal re-publish the same press agency report which doesn't actually mention Kamini Dube. That's a pitiful showing for someone who is supposedly "among the most eminent female personalities of India". And just to be sure that this is not some Google News fluke, I also checked the Times of India, The Hindu and Zee News. None of them has any coverage of Kamini Dube. She simply isn't notable enough to be the subject of a Wikipedia article. Huon (talk) 17:52, 4 May 2019 (UTC)

Hey Huon,

Sir, I understood the point regarding Kamini Dube, First of all, when I read and searched about Kamini Dube, I couldn't find anything about her in Wikipedia and I am in complete agreement with your point regarding Kamini Dube and I believe that she is a working woman, she has made the first movie about life and times of Greatest revolutionary Chandrasekhar Azad, 'Rashtraputra', also she will be soon releasing it in 28 national and international languages, which is the first time phenomena of world cinema, including her first mainstream feature film in Sanskrit language, 'Aham Brahmasmi' also she is the second lady producer from Asia after Mira Nair (Salam Bombay) who is going to create the history for Indian Cinema to show case the magnum opus Rashtraputra at Marche Du Film (France) at riviera 2 on 21st of May 2019, which is written directed and acted by military school student Aazaad and adding to this she is a prominent personality as she is the daughter of Hari Shankar Tiwari (Senior Politician and former Cabinet Minister from Chillupar, Gorakhpur, UP), and sister of ex MP Bhishma Shankar Tiwari and current MLA Chillupar Gorakhpur Vinay Shankar Tiwari, cousin of four consecutive times MLC elections winner Maharajganj and ex speaker state legislature of Uttar Pradesh, Ganesh Shankar Pandey, daughter in law of ex MLC Maharashtra, and ex Shiv Sena Sampark Pramukh Uttar Pradesh, founder of Uttar Bhartiya Mahasangh, Chairman of Ghanshyam Dube Shikshan Sansthan, Ghanshyam Dube, also Sister in law of National Youth Award and National Award Winner Dr. Yogesh Dube, and many more. And as per this knowledge and her tremendous contributions towards world cinemaa sooner or later she will get her wiki article published by either us or any other wiki editor. Her works will be open to world soon.

My concern here is, what is up to my knowledge that there is some mistake or misunderstanding or misconception regarding the article Bombay Talkies. Wikipedia is the most reliable source of world for getting knowledge for everything and being such a reliable source we cannot afford to make mistake. And I am wondered watching no trace of Rajnarayan Dube in the Bombay Talkies article. As I mentioned before there is no company named 'Bombay Talkies' it is the common name given to the four companies, The Bombay Talkies Ltd, The Bombay Talkies Studios, Bombay Talkies Pictures and Bombay Talkies Laboratories. And notably Himanshu Rai was director of The Bombay Talkies Ltd. holding only one percent share, and Rajnarayan Dube owned The Bombay Talkies Studios with Bombay Talkies Pictures and Bombay Talkies Laboratories as proprietor basis, holding maximum shares of The Bombay Talkies Ltd. as well, Therefore it shows all the four companies were under his command and were belongings of the mentioned person Rajnarayan Dube. He has contributed in hundreds of film apart from Bombay Talkies. And the company which shut down in 1954 was only The Bombay Talkies Ltd. so called bombay talkies by Wikipedia, excluding the three other companies viz. 'The Bombay Talkies Studios', 'Bombay Talkies Pictures', and 'Bombay Talkies Laboratories'. Also I am wondering how you can call Shashadhar Mukherjee and Ashok Kumar the owner of bombay talkies. Also it is a well-known thing that a limited company cannot be owned by a person, it is functioned by shareholders and management (directors, MD etc.) How can they own it then???

Thus my concern is not to offend you anywhere but there might be a big mistake done by Wikipedia editors while researching. Also I would like to highlight the thing regarding dates, what is the point if an article which is published later is not worthy? The writers who have written the books are much experienced and are veterans who knew Bombay Talkies before even you me or anyone of our group might know. And reading their stories I came to look forward for Rajnarayan Dube but couldn't find him anywhere in Wikipedia. I think there might be any conspiracy or some revenge kind of thing or whatever reason it might be behind absence of 'Rajnarayan Dube' in article of bombay talkies. I request you to please bring your concern towards this issue so that together we could help getting the exact info about the companies together called as bombay talkies. I can provide you with the published books about him also the reference links where he is mentioned and also a statement by grandson of Father of Indian Cinema, 'Dadasaheb Phalke' about Rajnarayan Dube. Also there are a lot of discussions went on about him, most of the political leaders, gazette officers, and respected persons of Indian Government who mentioned in their speeches and conferences about Rajnarayan Dube. Also veteran actors from Bollywood have mentioned about being existence of Rajnarayan Dube with Bombay Talkies. We cannot ignore their words.

Also I wonder on people speaking about the ownership of company, there is no direct claim from the families of so called owner of Bombay Talkies of their times Shashadhar Mukherjee and Ashok Kumar but Dube Family openly acclaims their rights on the company and also actively working since 2010.

Also there is a short documentary about Bombay Talkies named ‘’’‘Sangraha : The story of Bombay Talkies’’’’ by Sam Van Munnen on Vimeo. Find the link below: There it is clearly mentioned that Bombay Talkies needed a funder to fund the studio and Dube did that, also we can clear this as the warehouse which was owned by Rajnarayan Dube was the place where The Bombay Talkies Ltd. Was established. Thus Rajnarayan Dube’s name cannot be ignored as there are many of established industry actors and directors who were interviewed and spoke about the funder of The Bombay Talkies Ltd, Rajnarayan Dube. I request you to please bring your concern over here about this dispute and I request you to mention other high level editors as well so that together we can make this misconception clear and come to a conclusion. Because I don't think this could be a hoax as Dube's Family is a well reputed family here and they might not be false contenders. I will give you information about all with valid proofs I have. Let's bring our concern here and work on it as it is the most concerned dispute for me.

Help me sharing this everywhere. I’ll be available at times and will be responsive to whosoever needed. Callmesiddie (talk) 17:25, 5 May 2019 (UTC)

Vimeo is not a reliable source. If there are concerns about the content of the Bombay Talkies article, those concerns should be discussed at Talk:Bombay Talkies, preferably backed up by reliable published sources. How, for example, do you know the details of Rajnarayan Dube's shareholdings? I did a rather thorough search, and I'm pretty sure that none of the few books THAT mention Dube in connection with Bombay Talkies (of any kind, Ltd., Studios, Pictures or Laboratories) gave such details. It seems there are very many books that can very well ignore Dube's name. (As an aside, Wikipedia editors don't do their own original research; we summarize what reliable published sources have reported.)
On an unrelated note, the claim that Kamini Dube "is the second lady producer from Asia after Mira Nair" is wrong; to provide just one of many counterexamples, Gauri Khan is another film producer not just "from Asia" (which would of course include China, Japan, ...) but from Bollywood whose work predates that of Dube. Huon (talk) 19:43, 5 May 2019 (UTC)

Okay, I shall discuss this matter of bombay talkies in their talk page. But regarding Kamini Dube, I wanted to state that she is the second lady producer after mira nair to take her movie to france film festival known as Film de Cannes and going to showcase the movie in Marche du Film, Cannes this year may 21st. Callmesiddie (talk) 14:09, 6 May 2019 (UTC)

ArbCom 2019 special circular[edit]

Icon of a white exclamation mark within a black triangle
Administrators must secure their accounts

The Arbitration Committee may require a new RfA if your account is compromised.

View additional information

This message was sent to all administrators following a recent motion. Thank you for your attention. For the Arbitration Committee, Cameron11598 02:31, 4 May 2019 (UTC)

Administrator account security (Correction to Arbcom 2019 special circular)[edit]

ArbCom would like to apologise and correct our previous mass message in light of the response from the community.

Since November 2018, six administrator accounts have been compromised and temporarily desysopped. In an effort to help improve account security, our intention was to remind administrators of existing policies on account security — that they are required to "have strong passwords and follow appropriate personal security practices." We have updated our procedures to ensure that we enforce these policies more strictly in the future. The policies themselves have not changed. In particular, two-factor authentication remains an optional means of adding extra security to your account. The choice not to enable 2FA will not be considered when deciding to restore sysop privileges to administrator accounts that were compromised.

We are sorry for the wording of our previous message, which did not accurately convey this, and deeply regret the tone in which it was delivered.

For the Arbitration Committee, -Cameron11598 21:03, 4 May 2019 (UTC)

A barnstar for you![edit]

Citation Barnstar Hires.png The Citation Barnstar
Thanks to Huon for assisting me with some tricky citations. Much appreciated! Astro3.142 (talk) 18:33, 6 May 2019 (UTC)

Precious anniversary[edit]

Cornflower blue Yogo sapphire.jpg
Five years!

--Gerda Arendt (talk) 06:51, 9 May 2019 (UTC)

A barnstar for you![edit]

Compass Barnstar Hires.png The Guidance Barnstar
Thank you for all the help and support you have given me throughout my time on Wikipedia. You may not remember it, but your first edit to my talk page was in December 2017 when you declined my unblock request. I eventually got unblocked and you have the most edits to my talk page besides me. You recently surpassed Nick Moyes to be ranked No. 2 on most edits to my talk page. See here. Since I got unblocked, you have helped me a lot on IRC, my talk page, and with the help me template. Again, thank you for your contributions. Interstellarity (talk) 17:33, 12 May 2019 (UTC)

English page creation[edit]

I creatd an English page :

From the French page :

I want you add the sources like : "Notes et références" in the French page to the English page.


The French article's "Notes et références" section doesn't have any sources that could be added to the English draft. It's empty, just as empty as the English draft's "References" section. What the French article has are two navboxes that contain links to related Wikipedia articles; those are not sources or references, though their location at the bottom of the page might give the appareance that they're meant to be part of the "Notes et références" section.
Please also note that when you translate Wikipedia pages, you need to credit the authors of the original page; that's a requirement of the license under which the content is published. See Wikipedia:Translation#How to translate for details. Huon (talk) 18:47, 19 May 2019 (UTC)

English page creation[edit]

Plz insert the logo of the channel from the French page :

To the English page :


Note : I added the sources

There are two issues here:
  • The French Wikipedia's file page for the logo says it's copyrighted and non-free. Wikipedia does allow the use of non-free images under some conditions (see WP:Non-free content criteria), but one of those conditions is that such images must be used only in live articles, not in drafts. We'll have to wait with inserting the logo until the draft has been accepted. That brings us to the second issue.
  • What you added aren't sources but a navbox (I mentioned those above). By "sources" we mean the sources for the information in the draft which our readers can look up to verify that the content is accurate. Newspapers, trade magazines or books published with a reputable publisher make good sources; see also WP:Identifying reliable sources. WP:Referencing for beginners explains how to easily create nicely-formatted footnotes to cite your sources. Huon (talk) 22:46, 22 May 2019 (UTC)