Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/IncidentArchive270

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Ken Burns[edit]


resolved for now HappyFarmerofAsparagus 20:45, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

over the past few day user: (talk · contribs) has persisted in adding unsourced after repeated admonitions. before it gets out of hand, and to make sure i'm on a sure footing here, could someone please intervene? --emerson7 | Talk 21:16, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

Ummm. That is inappropriate of course but what is new about that? The section of Filmography has been unsourced since a long time as it is the case in many thousands of film articles. Just tag the section as unreferenced for now or discuss that at the talk page or you may even leave them a cool note at their talk page. I don't believe automated warnings would help in this case. -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 21:49, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
i even made a precursory attempt to validate the claim myself, but couldn't find anything. we'll try more diplomacy before escalating. --emerson7 | Talk 00:57, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
I've just left them a note. -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 01:23, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Single-purpose account, possible Licorne puppet[edit]


Looks to me like User:Relativity Priority Disputation has the same kinds of interests and opinions as permanently banned User:Licorne. Can anyone who knows more than me about checking such things look into whether they may possibly be the same or not? --Alvestrand 22:04, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

Provide diffs to WP:SSP. WP:AN/I is for administration discussion and very urgent matters. WP:SSP is for sock reporting. Let me know if I can help with answers. HappyFarmerofAsparagus 20:35, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Vandalism/Edit Warring[edit]

Please note here: [1]

User continues to vandalize pages and make dubious edits. He changes the word Jew to Isreali when source clearly uses word Jewish. Please protect page or block this vantal, who is likely sock of AdilB, see earlier report by me.Hetoum I 00:43, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Report at WP:AIV after proper warnings issued? HappyFarmerofAsparagus 20:33, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Abuse and Harassment by User:Darrenhusted[edit]

This user has been rude, sarcastic abused me on my discussion page [Discussion Page]. He has also gone so far as to accuse me of [sockpuppetry], which is completely false and he only did it to get me. I repeatedly asked him to stop messaging me in such a rude way and he continued to do so claiming I was making him "bang his head against the wall". I tried to reason to no avail and wanted the cool off time but he was still messaging me today. I will no longer edit anything here because of him. An Admin told me to go to Deletion Review and I did, I do not know who the people are that posted after my initial plea and could care less if their comments were removed because the comments part is over, BUT this does not give the Darren the right to harass me repeatedly after and poke fun at my inability to sign my posts correctly ( I am just clicking the sig link up top so I do not know what the trouble is) it worked when I copied and pasted another users sig and put my name in it so I am at a loss. He is a mean spirited, rude and sarcastic person who should be warned for his behavior. His blatent comment to WildThing that he is gonna smack indy fans down shows his true colors. Respectfully submitted, --EdWood 01:43, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

If you're certain that Darrenhusted's claim of sockpuppetry has no merit, then just wait until the checkuser case clears your name, and leave it at that. You've already been in contact with several admins, and the situation is under control. Leebo T/C 02:02, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
Again I am summoned by the call of my name....seriously though, if you truly aren't a sockpuppeter (and assuming good faith I'll believe you aren't), just wait until the checkuser case closes. Wildthing61476 02:17, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
If I can say a few words, most of this is already at the DRV for Chuck Taylor. The editor above and myself were editing an article which had been recreated (twice now) after a very long AfD, and AfD which for any one checking my contribs will see was one of about 25 which I have undertook in the last month. I have no personal animosity towards the editor nor any of the articles I nominted, they were PROD-ed (along with hundreds of other WP:PW articles) and when PRODs were removed I AfD-ed them. The first Chuck Taylor AfD was extensively filibustered by Theperfectone who ended up making no fewer than 61 edits to the AfD, and a further 100 edits to the actual article while the AfD was on, although he had edited almost exclusively that one article since joining (which I have no problem with, but it meant he has serious ownership issues), the first AfD ended with delete. I thanked the closing admin and continued editing other articles, as I did though the whole AfD process.
Less than 24 hours later the article was recreated, a CSD G4 was applied and removed, then a second AfD started, during which time I began editing the article down again, removing unverified claims (such as "he is considered one of the fastest rising indy stars" or words to that effect which tried to imply notability), removing an image which was not fair use, removing linkspam (mainly youtube and myspace) and removing week by week results (as most wrestling bios tend to bloat up with week by week results, and WP:PW guidelines try to limit them). As I edited I explained what I was doing in the edit summaries, and then added three messages to EdWood's homepage explaining what I was doing.
However while this was going on I was also checking the criteria for a CSD G4, and once I found that this article had violated it I stopped the AfD, reposted the CSD G4 tag, contacted the closing admin from the first AfD to explain what had happened and then messaged SirFozzie, and admin with whom I have spoken an many occasions and also who is a member of the wrestling project, and so understands wrestler bio notability better than most.
I then posted comments on the users who had taken part in the second AfD to let them know what I had done, and told EdWood to speak to the closing admin about recreation, and when contacted that closing admin told him he would not recreate the article and to go to DRV.
At the DRV I noticed that four of the editors all signed "two dashes and not using the tildes, [2], [3], [4], [5], a clear case of sock puppets or a massive coincidence?" and decided to tag the accounts in question with sock tags and then start a sock puppet case when I had the time (which would have been later that day).
As for messaging EdWood, since he posted this [6] I haven't messaged him, other than to tag user pages as socks.
And so far as the "admin who works with the WP:PW and so can bitch slap any indy fans" quote which Ed keeps bringing up, this was a comment made by me to Wildthing61476 (the nominator of the second AfD) about all the editors in both Chuck Taylor AfDs, not directly about EdWood, and was obviously meant to be humorous. By "bitch slap any indy fans" I meant that he wouldn't be taken in by their filibustering or exhortations that Chuck Taylor was notable.
The check user case says the eight listed are not socks, which is fine, because I have no doubt the closing admin on the DRV will give little or no weight to the two new and one recent user who found the DRV minutes after EdWood filed it.
So to sum up, as I do not intend to post at this ANI again, did I edit the Chuck Taylor page aggresively? Yes. Did I message EdWood? Yes. Have I harrassed or made direct personal threats to him? No. Did he want to keep Chuck Taylor even after he lost the AfD (which was actually a CSD G4)? Yes. Is he using socks to filibuster the DRV? I don't know but it looks suspicious to me. Am I sick of hearing the name Chuck Taylor? Yes.
The simple truth is Chuck Taylor's article did not state notability, not the first time, not the second time, and once the DRV finishes most likely not the third time. If Theperfectone, Matthewhack, EdWood or anyone else can prove otherwise, or if consensus is that he is notable then I am fine with the article being around, but so far the editors who want Chuck around seem to want to ignore the rules when it doesn't suit them and use them when it does.
I will not post any futher on this ANI, nor the DRV, so any issues can be brought to my talkpage. Darrenhusted 09:21, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Comment Nothing he said remotely covers his rudeness, sarcasm and aggressive nature towards me. He is disrespectful with people of different opinions. And for the record his blatent attempt to smear my name has failed as the sockpuppetry issue has been found to be false and we are ALL unrelated. He should be warned or something. --EdWood 16:52, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
False accusation of sock is very bad. Already, I've gone through a few issues below and people do use it. Diffs and proof, not just one sided accusations and no chance for defense. HappyFarmerofAsparagus 20
32, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Comment There was obviously a massive coincidence then that four seperate users would all sign using two dashes and not the tilde, I leave it up to an admin to look through the comments. EdWood continued to add myspace and youtube links back into an article after I had pointed out they were not reliable sources, after I removed a picture which was not fair use he continued to add it back in, even when I explained why it could not be used. He keeps claiming that I kept messaging him after he asked not to, which I did not, he keeps taking a quote from another user's talkpage and quoting it as if I made physical threats to him directly, which I did not. The four signatures look suspicious, and that two brand new users would make their first post trying to game a DRV, also seemed suspicious so I tagged the pages, and those users have not posted since, ready to start a checkuser, but by that point I was too tired and another user finished the process. If anything the AfD, DRV and ANI seem to be EdWood harrassing me, as I have edited on other pages while out of Ed's last 55 edits 49 have been on pages related to these actions and my user talkpage. So I invite an admin to look at the histories and get back to me, as I don't feel that "Abuse and Harrassment" is an accurate description of what has transpired here. Darrenhusted 21:54, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Beneath the bridge[edit]

This user's first ever edit was to my talk page: [7]. This edit s/he made was in response to me dedicating 2.5 hours of my time to fix re-directs. I replied calmly on his/her talk page, and when asked why s/he was behaving this way, responded with this edit: [8]. Later, after giving a Welcome note and encouraging him to maintain healthy relationships with other users on Wikipedia, replied by leaving vandalism on my talk page, as well as a death threat: [9]. Something needs to be done about this disruptive user, who has also left similar notices on a couple other pages, threatening other users for no particular reason. ––Ksy92003(talk) 08:24, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Blocked indef because of death threats and trolling of course. Happy editing. -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 08:30, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
Thank you, greatly. This was bothering me tremendously because I spent a huge amount of time making (at my count) 136 edits in a span of less than 2 hours, and only one user noticed... unfortunately, s/he failed to notice my hard work and resulted in death threats, which s/he later tried to reconcile for it by apologizing, telling me he think's I'm cool. Not a good way to begin using your editing privileges, as far as I'm concerned. But this bothered me greatly that another user could try to make me feel like my edits weren't appreciated when I spent a great amount of time on them. ––Ksy92003(talk) 08:35, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
He made a weird edit to my talk page, commenting on an article I just barely created. Weird. I support the indef block based on his edits to your user talk page. ···日本穣? · Talk to Nihonjoe 08:41, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
A very infamous tactic of trolls. -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 10:30, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
This particular one wasn't very effective as, on further consideration, I think he might have been trying to elicit an angry response from me. However, I took it as just a weird comment and responded with that in mind. Maybe it made him mad that he couldn't tweak me. >:) ···日本穣? · Talk to Nihonjoe 19:18, 11 July 2007 (UTC)



added by HappyFarmerofAsparagus 20:40, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Somebody admin needs to fix the mess Hindduking (talk • contribs • deleted contribs • nuke contribs • logs • filter log • block user • block log) just left. Corvus cornix 16:03, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

I think it's all fixed now. Will (aka Wimt) 16:18, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

User:Long levi[edit]

There is at least a possibility that the above user is a sock of community banned User:Tecmobowl, with a similar style (removing Fangraph links) and this person only started editing on the 6th of July, which is right after Tecmobowl was banned. It was brought up to my attention because I was the one who implemented the CN ban. I do not want to make the decision (I'm about to take a few days Wikibreak because of an illness) on a quick read. I think there's a strong circumstantial case. Could someone with a bit of free time investigate this? Is RfCU the best place to go? SirFozzie 18:13, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Diffs should be provided for a complete report. Just a suggestion. HappyFarmerofAsparagus 20:30, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Well, they both talk about the content being crappy and how nobody can concentrate on the content without bringing in other issues. Long Levi even defends Tecmo a few times without overtly naming him [10] [11]. Tecmo put in a bunch of templates for the Baseball hall of fame...and then Long Levi arrived and updated all those templates. There is also the fangraphs issue noted above. It could all be a big coincidence...but I doubt it. IrishGuy talk 22:51, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Sexual Harassment[edit]


Not to mention what amounts to vandalism, 3RR violations, and gross incivility. --Haizum μολὼν λαβέ 19:33, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

That's pretty unacceptable. I've issued Cr8tiv a 3-hour block to read WP:Civility. Looking further into this. A Traintalk 19:49, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Civility, please. Both may be wrong, don't know. Cr8tiv should have used only the 1st half of his comments of 19:31, not the bottom half. HappyFarmerofAsparagus 20:25, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

I agree, more or less. Please see my earlier comments on the talk pages of both editors. A Traintalk 20:40, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
Admittedly, I've only really had a glance, but Cr8tiv doesn't seem to have a history of going ballistic. I do agree with the block quite wholeheartedly, but I'm a bit confused why Haizum is being let off the hook for this rather obvious provocation. – Luna Santin (talk) 23:27, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
Not really sexual harassment, either. To turn feminist discourse (which is what the article is about) towards LGBT issues (which aren't even brought up in the article) and then brazenly call for POV-pushing against the "narrow-minded" is a bit provocative in and of itself. Haizum's response was just as ridiculous and unnecessary. Both parties are at fault. MSJapan 23:39, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
I agree with Luna. What's good for the goose is good for in this case, another goose, I suppose. Equality and all that, you know... ThuranX 23:47, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
I think this is a fair point and bears address. Both users were in the wrong here, but I adjudged Cr8tiv to be more so. Her actions were highly aggressive in tone, even before Haizum was involved (and my apologies if I'm incorrect in my pronoun choice, but the context of her edits leads me to believe that this is accurate).
Before Haizum even arrives on the scene, Cr8tiv makes this edit to the Herstory talk page, referring to heterosexuals as "breeders", something which cannot be mistaken for a polite term. I would have been equally shocked if an editor made a comment referring to homosexuals as "homos" or any such thing. Haizum replies on that talk page with a similarly unproductive edit for which I admonished him after I noticed it. In my opinion, the two comments made to this point in the incident cancel each other out. The problem (and the offense for which I blocked Cr8tiv) follows when Cr8tiv makes nine consecutive edits to Haizum's talk page - starting here and ending here. Many of these edits were replacing the original comment that she had left and Haizum had removed. The civility guidelines hold that a user is entitled to remove abusive comments from their talk page at their discretion; I don't personally believe in talk page sanitation, but Haizum had every right to remove the comments as he pleased.
Both editors made poor choices in their comments at the outset, but it was Cr8tiv who continued the confrontation and was more disruptive. I understand that Cr8tiv was provoked, but that does not absolve her misconduct. My action was to block Cr8tiv for 3 hours, and I left her a talk page message stating that I would immediately lift the block if she would only disengage from the matter. I do not use blocks punitively, only to stop disruptive behavior, and I almost always leave blocked editors with an opportunity to end their blocks immediately if possible. I feel that my actions were warranted and even-handed, but I welcome any criticism here or on my talk page. A Traintalk 03:27, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
I understand your rationale. It makes great sense to me. In reading the first edit of Cr8tiv's which you cite, though... Isn't that call for a 'queer army' a CANVASsing violation or the most egrigious and POV nature? Please warn her about pursuing that agenda. ThuranX 04:50, 12 July 2007 (UTC)[edit] (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · filter log · WHOIS · RDNS · RBLs · http · block user · block log) had a six month block imposed on January 11 which just expired. It looks like most of the edits made today are vandalism (a couple are too foreign to me to know and several are subtle). Can someone take a look (I need to get some RW work done) and act if necessary. -- DS1953 talk 23:04, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

The two edits to Sandpit (reverted) are vandalism, the one to stylus (reverted) may just be misguided, and the two to Saskatoon are tests (self-reverted). I'm not sure about the rest: this edit to List of Chicago street gangs, two edits to Liebermann Inc., this edit to Chess Pieces (MÄR), and this edit to ÄRM. -- Black Falcon (Talk) 23:18, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
I agree with Black Falcon, except the List of Chicago street gangs had major verifiability issues, and looks like it had a questionable history of anonymous editors adding random names. I have since blanked all redlinked gangs and asked for future additions to the list to be verifiable. (sorry, I don't mean to hijack the thread). As for the anon, if it is a shared IP, as the tag at the top of the page suggests, that could explain why there are some seemingly helpful edits and some clear vandalism. If the vandalism persists, it may be best to block again, but allow new account creation.-Andrew c [talk] 23:26, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
The list of gangs page definitely needed a cleanup (the older version seemed to suggest that Chicago was full of "Almighty"s, "Cobra"s, and "Insane"s). ;) And you're definitely right about the edits being made by different people. The edits to List of Chicago street gangs and Saskatoon (tests, most likely) were made 04:19 - 04:55 UTC. Four hours later came the two edits to Liebermann Inc.. Five hours later ... two edits to articles related to MÄR. Eight hours later ... 3 unconstructive edits, including two instances of obvious vandalism. I have bookmarked the IP's contributions history and will continue to monitor it. -- Black Falcon (Talk) 00:26, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Unsettling edits from anonymous IP[edit]

These might just be vandalism along the lines of the Chris Benoit article fiasco, but I did want to bring these to someone's attention, just in case. Anyway, please check the following three diffs from User:

Please note that this IP has been warned in January, May, and April of this year, which probably suggests simple vandalism, but again, some of these more recent comments from this month are a bit concerning. --Le Grand Roi des CitrouillesTally-ho! 00:20, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Not sure if it would violate the privacy policy and what not, so I will not post the link, but Ryan Davis, 22 yr old college student from southern California, shown holding a gun, with no mention of the 12 year old, is very much alive. Not really sure what, if anything, needs to be done. - auburnpilot talk 00:31, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
I've given the IP a 72 hour block for vandalism. This kind of post normally goes to WP:AIV for swifter attention. DurovaCharge! 00:48, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

User:Team RS2[edit]


Has no edits. The User page seems to be a page where members of a web forum can attack each other. Corvus cornix 03:10, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Page deleted per CSD U2. —Kurykh 03:13, 12 July 2007 (UTC)


I'd appreciate if someone could look at Masada and tell me why I've been blocked from editing when I'd added copious, reliable and irrefutable sources. More perplexing, why have all my contributions from other articles been retroactively undone by jayjg and blocked?

Every time I contributed, I cited and I also defended in the talk page. Jayjg never once attempted to communicate or question me. I see from his history that he has a disturbing pattern of this together with other editors who attacked me humus sapien and k's ghost.

Basically, every archaeologist, anthropologist, sociologist, forensics expert (all of them Israeli) since have concluded that the "Masada" dig and the claim that it revealed Masada was a fraud. If you look at the history of the article and the talk page you'll see that I've provided overwhelming sources and cites - none disputed. And they come from people like the Dean of Sociology and Anthropology at Hebrew University who painstakingly read three years of transcriptions from the initial dig to prove that it was an open fraud among the team members (again, please refer to the talk page of Masada).

Inexplicably, jayjg took out references to this dean from the article that predated my contributions. And so, now the article makes no mention of considerable scholarship that's exposed the original dig.

I see this as part of a disturbing pattern of partisan editing and blocking that ignoring well-cited contributions when the subject is in anyway unflattering to Israel. The result is an absurd article, like Masada, that makes no mention of a fact that every schoolchild in Israel knows: Masada is a myth with no basis in scholarship. Truth-evenifithurts 03:48, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Without judging the merits of your claims, they would be more convincing if you were not a likely sockpuppet. MastCell Talk 05:32, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Note the parallel thread at User talk:Jimbo Wales. Shalom Hello 05:37, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Rtkat3 ignoring notes about edit summaries[edit]

User:Rtkat3 continues to use no edit summaries for his edits. People have told him this numerous times on his talk page. I told him about edit summaries recently as well and he ignored it once again. I see no final warning for not using edit summaries, so I'm not sure what else to do. He seems to speak english, so there is no language barrier. Admin intervention is needed I think. He should be using edit summaries at least sometimes. RobJ1981 21:56, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

Using edit summaries is polite and helpful, but it's not specifically required as far as I know. If you've asked him to and he refuses, best thing is probably just to drop it. Seraphimblade Talk to me 22:52, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
From what I can tell, he never (or rarely) even posts on talk pages. Why should a person that refuses to use summaries, just be ignored? I don't see him as a vandal: but who actually knows that for sure? With no summaries, people don't even know what he is adding or removing from articles. In my view, it's a bit of bad faith he refuses to even say why he wont use summaries. It seems to be important from the sounds of this: Template:Summary2. A little bit from it: Please do your best to always fill in the summary field. This is considered an important guideline in Wikipedia. Even a short summary is better than no summary. A simple thing like summaries shouldn't be a big issue. It takes a small amount of time. RobJ1981 04:44, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
I've emailed him, so if he doesn't reply... I will be under the understanding that he just wants to do what he wants, without listening to others. Edit summaries are indeed important, and people shouldn't just ignore putting them. RobJ1981 22:29, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
As one last update (since no one seems to care about this issue, which is a bit wrong), he emailed me back and didn't even give a reason for not using edit summaries. This is simply bad faith in my opinion. RobJ1981 17:07, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Nowadays, with the comments line being auto-filled with such information as the section header, it clearly requires intent not to leave a comment. From reading his talk page, it appears that the only time he ever communicates with another Wikipedian is when he is caught in an autoblock -- despite numerous questions about his edits. (A check with Kate's Tool shows that out of over 17,000 edits, he has only made 80 edits to all categories of Talk pages.) Clearly a taciturn person -- but he's also clearly pushing the envelope in the opposite direction.
I'm adding to this thread -- when RobJ1981 has already said everything I could say on the matter -- because I recently encountered a similar user who likewise refused to discuss his edits, & had no idea how to force the person into a conversation. (Unlike Rtkat3, this editor did not have an email address listed.) Well, short of an indef block until he was willing to talk -- a solution I wouldn't want to try because it is a tactic identical to using a sledgehammer to kill a mosquito. This taciturn mindset (almost passive-aggressive) baffles me: why edit Wikipedia in good faith if you don't want to discuss your edits with other people? AFAIK, writers always enjoy talking or writing about their writing. -- llywrch 17:18, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Harassment and more disruptions from socks of User:Mariam83[edit]

User:Mariam83 has decided to launch a new campaign of harassment and disruption of her favourite articles and enemy editors and admins via her multiple dynamic IP socks hailing from both Houston, TX, USA and China.

This is getting out of hand. A range block of that Texas IP is in order. --Ezeu 07:48, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Anything we can do to prevent the individual behind Mariam83 from editing Wikipedia is warranted.Proabivouac 07:54, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
WP:RBI. One day she will get tired. -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 08:21, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

I just found three more of her IPs (on the same page even), but it looks like you guys have tagged them already. Good work! -- Hux 06:15, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Plus the daily few emails she is using to harass and blackmail me! I am doing some investigations to see if the user had had any prior involvment in wikipedia because i suspect she/he has gone through this before a year ago though it concerned another set of articles. I'll try to bring updates here. -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 09:42, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Xratedguy leaving deviously-constructed messages[edit]

Resolved: Blocked indef by Ryulong

Here is the text left on various pages by Xratedguy (talk • contribs • deleted contribs • nuke contribs • logs • filter log • block user • block log). I gave him a uw-vandal2 warning, but don't have time to monitor his activities.

Roland Rance has studied this for years and has discovered that Trotskyite feces tastes better than the alternatives [16]

It's SPAM and vandalism rolled into one. I have reverted his 8 or so identical contributions. Please watch out for this guy.--Otheus 08:32, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

This is yet another sockpuppet of Runtshit, who has so far created over 200 false IDs and defaced nearly 200 articles in his obsessive stalking of me. See this list. S/he is almost certainly llinked to the Truthprofessor and Zuminous serial vandals. It appears that we are powerless to stop this character, and can only go around clearing up after him/her. RolandR 08:57, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Please add Quadratics (talk • contribs • deleted contribs • nuke contribs • logs • filter log • block user • block log) to the RolandR stalkers. Thank you. Otheus 09:05, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

User:BillyTFried: Threatening Behavior?[edit]

This is an interesting question for the Wikipedia community: Does posting a link on a member’s Talk page to a YouTube video of yourself firing a weapon constitute threatening behavior?

Background: In the article about San Francisco Supervisor Chris Daly, I have been debating BillyTFried about whether the article should include information about Daly’s support of a 2006 gun control ballot initiative, Proposition H. I said it shouldn’t because Daly was only one of four sponsors of the initiative, and the initiative wasn’t especially controversial in SF (it won with 58% of the vote). However, because the initiative was controversial in the eyes of many pro-gun groups, it made national headlines with Daly’s name featured in newspaper articles, etc., BillyTFried thought Proposition H should be included in the Chris Daly article.

YouTube video: Yesterday night, BillyTFried posted some words on my Talk page along with a link to a YouTube video of himself firing what looks like a semi-automatic weapon. (In case the video gets taken down, it is 1:43 minutes long and shows BillyTFried firing weapons at a shooting range while thrash music plays. BillyTFried occasionally leers at the camera. The video is titled “Shoot Em' Up!”.)

Last night when I read his post, I thought it was just plain weird and creepy, but I didn’t feel threatened. This morning, however, I mentioned it to my wife, who was horrified. She pointed out that BillyTFried lives in the same town as me (he told me the cross streets where he lives) and that his post on my Talk page with the video link was made in the context of a gun control debate. She thought he was threatening me.

I did not take up this matter with BillyTFried because, frankly, after watching his video, I don't want anything to do with him. I’m just curious what the community thinks of this and whether some action should be taken against BillyTFried. Griot 16:14, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

(statement from non-admin and completely uninvolved party Pfagerburg, who happened to notice this thread as I was checking to see if the vandal came back.)
Check the date the video was uploaded - early January of this year, not yesterday. Lots of people take videos of themselves, family members, or friends firing weapons at the range. BillyTFried was trying to make a point that there are some gun-owners living in SF. He made it poorly, and clumsily, but I don't see it as a threat. To be a threat, the video would have to be linked with the text "you're next" or "stay out of this debate or else." Or your name would have to be involved somehow, like "warning to Griot - don't try to take my guns!" That would be a criminal threat for which the threatener ought to be prosecuted. Possibly WP:NPA or WP:CIVIL, but nothing criminal. Pfagerburg 16:30, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
I understand that YouTube is full of videos of people at shooting ranges and people blasting away at bottles and cans in the great outdoors. But this video was presented to me in the context of gun control. BillyTFried understands my dislike of guns but he posted the video link anyway on my Talk page. If I was a vegetarian and he posted a video link to slaughterhouse video, would that be okay? Griot 18:16, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
(An additionally totally univolved editor User:Rocksanddirt) I would find that the context of the video being put on a Griot's user page as threatening or at least an attempt to intimidate the debate. If billyt had put it on his own page, that would be a totally different scenario. --Rocksanddirt 18:31, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
I've issued a warning to the editor. At best it was just really poor judgment and as Rocksanddirt said, at worst it has the appearance of an attempt to intimidate.--Isotope23 18:40, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
No, it (vegetarian and the slaughterhouse video) wouldn't be OK. It would be boorish. And uncivil. The same applies to the gun video. And in the days of Columbine and Virginia Tech, it borders on just plain stupid. It's a good way to get the police interested in speaking with you, but in the end, the police and the DA would probably conclude it was not criminal.
I'm not trying to defend BillyTFried's actions, but rather present what I feel is the middle ground, the two extremes being "quit whining" and "OMG! Call the cops!" He probably owes you an apology, but I don't think he threatened you, either in the WP sense or in the criminal sense. My opinion (that and 50 cents will buy you a coke) is that he ought not to be blocked, but it wouldn't hurt for the admins to have a chat with him. Pfagerburg 18:40, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Isotope23, I saw your edit after I saved mine. Rocksanddirt has a valid point as well. Let's hope the warning has the desired effect. Pfagerburg 18:52, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

WHAT A JOKE!!! Christ you couldn't win a debate against me where you tried to censor valid information on the Chris Daly page and TALK page:, so instead to accuse me of threatening you simply because after you insinuated that everyone was anti-gun in "Liberal SF" I replied that I was in fact MYSELF a San Francisco resident and avid gun owner, and posted a video of myself enjoying my hobby, legally, and safely, as visual proof of it. Your assertion that it was somehow a threat is just more hysterics from a person who has already shown ridiculously bizarre behavior by trying to censor valid information on Wikipedia, despite protest from everyone else involved. It's also very interesting that you DELETED all my comments on your talk page EXCEPT that one. If anyone want to see the whole conversation it is reproduced on MY TALK PAGE --BillyTFried 19:05, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Billy, you don't seem to get it. Posting a video of yourself shooting a weapon on another editors talk page when you know full well they are a gun control advocate was very poor judgment and not in any way WP:CIVIL and it isn't hard to see how someone could take that as an attempt at an intimidation tactic on your part. As I said on your talk page, I expect this will not happen again; future incidents like this will likely result in a block.--Isotope23 19:11, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
Then the proper way to point out that not everybody in SF is anti-gun would have been to write "but I live in SF and I am not anti-gun." If Griot had challenged your residence or position, then the cross streets and the video might have been appropriate.
Yes, I saw that he did question your residence, after I posted the comment above. I struck the comment, and apologized. You probably started to edit and put in your reply before I was able to save my strike-out. Pfagerburg 19:52, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
I don't think your video was at all a threat, but in today's "it doesn't matter what you meant, it's what the other person perceived" environment (you normally hear this in sexual harassment cases), you really need to be more careful what you say and how you say it.
I've been to SF, and I've never felt more un-safe anywhere else in the country. That city's gun-control measures have made sure that only the criminals are armed. But if you don't calmly refute the argument with facts, and instead start yelling about it, you hand them the victory. Pfagerburg 19:17, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Oh I won't take any risks with hysterical paranoid people again, but I do not apologize and I reject the assertion that it was meant as intimidation as it WAS NOT AT ALL, and was simply meant to REFUTE his assertion that everyone in SF was anti-gun, as it was a nice video of my enjoying my hobby, shooting at a local SF Bay Area shooting range, both legally and safely. There was nothing at all uncivil or criminal in what I did in any way. The reaction to is is just pure hysterics. And attempting to and even threatening to have me blocked from Wikipedia over it is simply outrageous! --BillyTFried 19:22, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

<Text Dump removed. please see content at User talk:BillyTFried#Chris Daly>

If you're going to discuss content, then it belongs on the relevant talk page. If you're going to sling mud at each other (Daly vs. Newsom style), then do it on your own blogs or something. Neither are welcome on this board, and the latter not welcome on Wikipedia. And I say this as both a Wikipedia admin and a resident of San Francisco. —Kurykh 19:32, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
I've removed the text dump above.--Isotope23 19:35, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
Billy, what you did was incivil and the reaction here is not "pure hysterics" as you've put it. If you can't see the obvious overtones of linking a video of youself shooting a gun on another editors' userpage when you are in a dispute with them over gun control then perhaps there is a problem here. I'm in no way a gun control advocate, but it's plain as day how another editor could take that linking as a veiled threat.--Isotope23 19:39, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
Disagree. The reaction was "pure hysterics." Use of the video was rude and not very smart, but the "ZOMG, did he threaten me?!?!" attitude gets us, e.g.
  • Aqua Teen Hunger Force Mooninite sign fiasco in Boston
  • Muslims removed from a plane because they prayed before a flight
  • A cartoonist fired from his job over a discussion with a friend of what sort of gun he would like to buy for target practice
You are a duck. There is water on your back. Quack and swim on.
If someone makes an actual threat, report it to the police instead of whinging on Wikipedia. Admins will get involved when the police ask for the logs. Pfagerburg 19:57, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
That's a bit of apples and oranges Pfagerburg. The recipient felt threatened and reported it here, I'm not so sure I would characterize that as hysterics. Now Boston getting totally owned by the Moon... that was hysterics (and amusing ones at that).--Isotope23 20:41, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

WE WERE NOT DEBATING GUN CONTROL AT ALL! We were debating whether on not a failed gun control bill belongs on the Chris Daly page as he was the main name attached to that bill whenever it turned up in the media, but Griot has continually deleted the valid and sourced information I posted. He asked me "Billy. Do you really live in SF? If you did, you would know that Proposition H was no big deal in the City" and I replied with my cross streets and the video proving that I was s SF resident and gun owner. This has been totally blown out of proportion and is just ridiculous! --BillyTFried 19:44, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

And when you were just discussing about including references to a gun control ballot measure, you found it necessary to post a video of you brandishing a gun (or whatever) on his talk page. How appropriate. CoughKurykh 19:47, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
Exactly. It was completely unnecessary to post that video on his talkpage and this in no way is being blown out of proportion. Assuming good faith, you didn't mean any harm, though the fact that you seem unwilling or unable to understand why this was a bad idea isn't exactly encouraging. Regardless, you've been warned and I expect you will show better judgment in your future contact with other editors.--Isotope23 19:52, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

CHUCKLE??? Yeah right, that sure sounds like a really intimdated threatened person doesn't! Jeez! --BillyTFried 19:59, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

You still have not addressed any of our points, instead resorting to answering to some nonexistent question. Please get back on topic. —Kurykh 20:06, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

What "points" do I need to answer??? --BillyTFried 20:07, 11 July 2007 (UTC)


:And when you were just discussing about including references to a gun control ballot measure, you found it necessary to post a video of you brandishing a gun (or whatever) on his talk page. How appropriate. CoughKurykh 19:47, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Kurykh 20:08, 11 July 2007 (UTC)


He asked me "Billy. Do you really live in SF? If you did, you would know that Proposition H was no big deal in the City" and I replied with my cross streets and the video proving that I was s SF resident and gun owner. This has been totally blown out of proportion and is just ridiculous! --BillyTFried 19:44, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

--BillyTFried 20:11, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

This has not been blown out of proportion. It was a reasonable interpretation of your actions. —Kurykh 20:14, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

He ask me, "Billy. Do you really live in SF? If you did, you would know that Proposition H was no big deal in the City" because it was not an issue for anyone in what he called "Liberal SF", and I responded by saying YES, IN FACT I DO LIVE IN SF, and am a gun owner who saw lots of commotion over the gun ban (whether or not he saw it), and heres my cross streets and a video of me to prove that people like me DO EXIST here in "Liberal SF". next thing you know, I'm being accused of threatening him!!! --BillyTFried 20:20, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Yes this has been totally blown out of proportion, and not every here agrees with your assertion that it has not. See above comments about Aqua Teen Hunger Force and Muslims removed from planes for praying. It's all plane old fashioned hyterics. --BillyTFried 20:23, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

So as to be clear.... Is anyone here actually taking the position what I posted was meant as a THREAT rather than what I said my intention was, and if so what exactly was the threat that you believe I was making? --BillyTFried 20:30, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

  • Look we've been over this. Whether you intended this to be a threat or not (and I believe you didn't), it was still grossly incivil and it is blindingly easy to see how someone could interpret this as an attempt to chill the debate by posting this on their talkpage. Whether you intended it to be such or not is impossible to say, I have no idea what your actual intent was, but I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt here. At this point, you are not being blocked for this and you are simply being warned not to do that again; try and take some time to think how something like that will be perceived by other editors before you hit that submit button. As all that is happening at this point is a warning, I would suggest that the prudent thing for you to do is drop this and move on to editing articles.--Isotope23 20:35, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

  • Yeah, whatever. I do not apologize and reject any assertion that I threatened anyone. In fact I didnt't even engage in name calling as Grito has. Maybe I should lodge my own complaint about his continued use of the offesnive slur "Gun Nut". Hmmm. --BillyTFried 20:44, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Nobody asked you to apologize (and calling out that you "don't apologize" comes off as a bit juvenile I might add... I don't think anyone was going to mistake anything you've said here for an apology), as I said above, the prudent thing to do here would be to quit while you are ahead.--Isotope23 20:51, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
Actually, I suggested that he owed Griot an apology. But that was just my opinion, which carries very little weight here. Pfagerburg 20:57, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
Sorry, I must have missed that post of yours... and your opinion carries as much weight as mine or anyone elses' Pfagerburg.--Isotope23 20:59, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Oops, you beat me to it! --BillyTFried 21:05, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

If anything Griot owes me an apology for his unjusitfied continual deletion of my valid and cited material on the Chris Daly page, as well as insulting me with his constant use of the slur Gun Nut, and my having to address all this noise over nothing. --BillyTFried 21:05, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

I move to close this discussion thread. All appropriate Admin actions have been taken, & the subsequent exchanges are no longer relevant to WP:AN/I, if they were in the first place. -- llywrch 17:31, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Removal of comments[edit]

I thought my comments were fairly reasonable. I left a comment on Jimbo's talk page asking for his help on something. The comment was reverted by User:SqueakBox a few seconds later [17], [18]. Now I know I'm an anon user, but I believe Jimbo should be the one deciding whether I'm a troll or not. I left my justifications for my comment on SqueakBox's talk page, but that also got deleted without an answer [19]. Now if I'm an anon user and I want to contact Jimbo, don't I have the right to do so? Please do something about this, at least let Jimbo see my comment. -- 22:58, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

If Jimbo were to be the judge of every wikipedia troll he'd be working o0n that alone fopr 168 hours a week, SqueakBox 23:44, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
That reasoning still doesn't justify you removing my comments. -- 23:45, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
That isnt the reasoning I used to justify my deletion, my justification is that you were trolling. Persoanlly I think you are still trolling, SqueakBox 23:47, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
I don't agree with that, either. It is your personal opinion, and as I said, it should be up to Jimbo to decide whether I was trolling or not. Therefore, my comment should be left on his talk page, since it is not vandalism. -- 23:54, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
Well I strongly disagree, Jimbo doesnt have the time which is why people like me watch his page and remove stuff that isnt appropriate for him, a bit like a secretary weeding out the unnecessary stuff. You could try the office but there you will get some low level type like myself and would have to persuade them before comments were FAO Jimbo Wales, SqueakBox 16:41, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
This discussion needs some context, so I looked to see what the anon's comment was about. It can be summarized in three words -- a complaint about Ghirlandajo, which is considered by many Wikipedians as a textbook example of WP:DEADHORSE, if not its synonym. To the Anon: I don't know any of the specifics of this incident, or its merits, but if you so desperately need to tell Jimbo about it, his talk page is probably a bad medium to use. Do it in email, & you don't have to worry about what the rest of us think or do about your message. But be warned: I know from personal experience that it can take over a month for him to respond to an email, & thats if it involves someone he wants to talk with. If he doesn't respond at all, accept his silence & move on. -- llywrch 17:48, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Harrassment by Jersyko: Dispute is between Jersyko and Jimbo Wales[edit]


Jersyko has a dispute with Feddhicks. He has listed me on a RFCU. User:Jimbo Wales unblocked me after Jersyko blocked me. I have removed my name from the RFCU. There is precedent for name self removal. Jersyko has done that before on himself, I believe.

I offered to informally mediate which he refused and I said that's ok, I only try to facilitate, not force a solution. In retaliation, Jersyko is running a RFCU.

Action requested: stop harrassment by Jersyko.

Diff: [[20]] proving that Jimbo Wales has determined that I am not Dereks1x. The RFCU Dereks1x versus me. Jimbo Wales received private information to establish my identity and other proof. VK35 00:26, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

You do realize that this might be your chance to shut Jersyko up with a Checkuser. Anyway, you're over-inflating Jimbo's stature in this dispute; he's just acting like any other administrator. I really don't care if you're a sock or not, but these are my thoughts. —Kurykh 00:29, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
I added VK35 to the checkuser request because (1) a checkuser (dmcdevit) confirmed to me weeks ago that VK35 was editing from the same IP range as Dereks1x and (2) VK35 made a unique, odd offer to "mediate" between me and the sock of a banned user I had just indef blocked. Coincidentally, the sock I blocked just so happened to be a sock of the same banned user that VK35 is known to share an IP range with. My carefully worded addition to the RFCU is here. I meant no offense; Kurykh is right that this is the best possible chance to shut me up about it. · jersyko talk 00:32, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Will you, Jersyko, agree to be banned if you are wrong and I am right?VK35 00:48, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Sorry, I missed this comment in the fray. No, I won't "agree to be banned." I will agree, however, to "shut up" and "leave you alone". · jersyko talk 00:52, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
I'm sorry if I was a bit too direct. —Kurykh 00:36, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
No, not at all. You're right, and I agree with you. · jersyko talk 00:38, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
The offer to informally mediate is not odd. I have done it for Gibraltar, Missouri, some list of developed countries, and helped out in AFD fights. (Don't be surprised if Bobblehead and Tvoz comment, they usually comment in support of Jersyko and each other) VK35 00:46, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Informal mediation isn't odd at all. Informal mediation when one of the parties is a sock of a banned user who is already blocked before the mediation is even started, that's odd. · jersyko talk 00:49, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Yup, because we are sockpuppets of each other, after all.[21] --Bobblehead (rants) 00:53, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
This is a distraction in my attempt to reach 5,000 quality mainspace edits this year, 900+ so far, 47 new articles. Will you stop this harrassment and let me get back to editing. Harrassment grinds editing to a halt. VK35 01:12, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Why is this a distraction? If you've truly done nothing wrong, the checkuser will come back negative and you don't need to care about it. -Amarkov moo! 01:25, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
    • Checkuser isn't magic pixie dust. Whether VK35 is a Dereks1x sock ultimately depends on the similarity of their edits; we already know that they've used similar IP ranges in the past. We also know that VK35 has been blocked as Dereks1x's sock before, and that several editors (including me) thought that the block was appropriate; Jimbo disagreed and unblocked VK35. I thought that was a mistake then, and still do now. --Akhilleus (talk) 01:45, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
      • I know very well that checkuser isn't magic pixie dust, and I assure you I trust it much less than you do. What I was saying is that being involved in the checkuser case by itself shouldn't be concerning. He can be blocked as a sock otherwise, but that has nothing to do with whether or not he is included in the checkuser case. -Amarkov moo! 01:48, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
        • Sorry, I was trying to point out that since a negative checkuser result is not necessarily decisive, it may not end the suspicion that VK35 is a sock, and thus, he may continue to feel "harassed". --Akhilleus (talk) 02:03, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

You shouldn't over emphasize this as a "dispute between Jersyko and Jimbo" to try and get people on your side. As another user stated, Jimbo simply acted as any other third party admin would upon getting such information.--Jersey Devil 02:39, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

And unfortunately Jimbo may not have been in possession of all of the facts. As Akhilleus said, it was a mistake then and now. I find it curious, and disturbing, that VK35 removed himself from the latest Dereks1x checkuser request, if he had nothing to worry about. Tvoz |talk 03:00, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
And Grandmasterka reinstated his name in the RFCU and VK35 removed it again, as well as removing another sock from the list which is suspicious. Both names are back on the RFCU now, and I think we should let the process take its course. Tvoz |talk 15:52, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
See [[22]]. There is precedent for name self-removal at RFCU. See Jersyko/Tvox 4/30/07 RFCU (accused to be meat/socks, they wipe their names off) VK35 16:00, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
That is not precedent for this, that was retaliatory RFCU, if I recall correctly. Go on with your editing - if you have nothing to worry about, you have nothing to worry about. Let the process proceed. Tvoz |talk 16:34, 12 July 2007 (UTC)]

RFCU completed. VK35 18:17, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

And here's a link to the result of the RFCU.[23] --Bobblehead (rants) 18:26, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Which was clarified here - adding this for the record, in the event that this subject is revisited. Tvoz |talk 23:30, 13 July 2007 (UTC)

User:TexasAndroid and anonymous editors[edit]

I am not certain that this is the proper venue and if not will appreciate any information that will point me in the proper direction. For the past six weeks or so I've been dealing with a situation that I consider to be unacceptable and against Wikipedia policy.

I apologize in advance for the length of this discussion but am attempting to make sure that all relevant information is presented.

"Yes it's me, the anon user who nominated Brian Crecente for deletion. I was debating on nominating her (Jennifer Ann Crecente) article as well, but I figured since you added alot to it, I would run it by you first. I feel neither her article or the charity are really notable so I've been thinking about a possible merge of her article and the charity based on her, what are your thoughts? I know you are probably angry about the comments I made in the Brian Crecente afd, so I don't expect your words to be sugar coated. Please speak your mind. 10:22, 6 June 2007 (UTC)"
  • And then on June 12, 2007:
" ... I am still consulting with a few other users about the pages we are questioning, we are currently looking for sources. Going to give it another week or two and then a possible rewrite or afd will be dealt."
  • On June 26, 2007 I requested a [deletion review] and received comments like "G4 shouldn't be used when the article is markedly different, DelRev shouldn't need to be involved." The deletion was overturned and the article instead moved to AfD where the consensus was Keep.

Now that I have gone through all of the steps necessary to get the article back to its proper status I would like some assistance in resolving what I believe is an abuse by having this article "speedy deleted" in the first place. I feel that it is likely not a coincidence that I was threatened with this deletion by an anonymous user eight days before User:TexasAndroid followed through with a deletion.

At this point I am concerned that future disagreements (regardless of the civility) will result in having articles that I've created either vandalized or deleted. Any assistance or advice is appreciated.

Drew30319 01:29, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Apart from the failure to assume good faith here, why would he wait for more than a week to carry through this "threat" (which isn't actually a threat of deletion, just a threat of discussing it)? -Amarkov moo! 01:38, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
On June 12, 2007 the anonymous user stated that there would be "another week or two" before action was taken. The action that was taken eight days later was that User:TexasAndroid did a "speedy delete" that was considered by myself and others to be inappropriate. This article had been sitting there for four months without any problems or questions regarding its legitimacy.
While it might be proper policy for me to assume that this was a coincidence I would appreciate other eyeballs looking at this situation to gain further insight. Drew30319 02:35, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Well, the current article history doesn't display the nomination for speedy, if there was one. Perhaps the anon user waited 8 days then nominated for speedy, and that last revision simply wasn't restored. Maybe that's not what happened, but an admin can check that very easily. Someguy1221 03:31, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Isn't it wonderful when people try to work out disagreements with each other before dragging themselves into public? Oh, wait. That did not happen. Well, isn't it great when someone gets notified that there has been a complaint lodged against them? Oh wait. That did not happen either. I had to stumble across this here to find out about it.

And the funny thing is, when I did speedy the article, I took the time to give Drew a notice right on his talk page, letting him know what had happened, and pointing him directly to DRV. I have since watched the DRV overturn me, sending the page back to AFD, and the second AFD result in a Keep. So be it. My action was in enforcement of the first AFD, which was IMHO still in effect at the time of the recreation. DRV saw otherwise, and that is why DRV exists. We admins do not make descisions in a vacuum, we are subject to review. And sometimes we get overturned. So be it. It happens. We are human, and not perfect. But IMHO, the 2nd AFD should have been the end of things.

But, now we get this report here. And I have to justify my actions. Sigh. So be it. Let's begin.

First off, I have nothing to do with the mentioned IPs. I have never edited from an IP address. Not before I registered, and not afterwards. I had never interacted with Drew30319 before the speedy deletion.

Second, to explain how I did find the article. I'm a Wikignome, of the Category Gnome subvariety. I do a lot of work on categories, cleaning them up, etc. At the time, I was doing work on articles in various major cities in Texas, mostly working to clear out the main city categories, and push as many articles as possible down into sub-categories. Buildings go into the building and structure sub-cats. People go into the people sub-cats, etc. The fact that I was doing this work on Texas articles is easily verifiable by anyone who wants to look at my history for that time period. When I got to Austin, and was working on clearing out Category:Austin, Texas, there was the Jennifer Ann Crecente article. My first instinct was that it was a borderline A7 speedy candidate. Except maybe for the legislation, there was IMHO nothing notable about her. When I hit the initial delete button, I saw that the article had been previously deleted, and by AFD at that. That, IMHO, made it a recreation, and subject to G4 speedy, which was the more appropriate criteria for an article still under the enforcement of an AFD.

DRV overturned me. As I have said, so be it. OTOH, I still think that proper procedure for the article's creator would have been to get the AFD overturned for the new article before it was returned to article space. Moving the article back to article space while there is still a valid AFD against is not the right way to do things. It really would also have been very nice if Drew30319 had made some attempt to resolve his problems with me on my talk page before he took them public. He has never before heard my explanation for how I came across the article, in good part because he never bothered to ask. He just lobbed these accusations out of the blue, here in public first. And then does not bother to even let me know that my actions are being debated. Quite annoying, all-together. - TexasAndroid 15:18, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

  • The following was left on my talk page but I would prefer to have this conversation intact:

I have responded to your accusations of abuse at WP:ANI. It would have been really nice if you had bothered to try to resolve these issues with me personally before you drug this all out to WP:ANI. It would have been nice if you had bothered to inform me that you had lodged a complaint against me, instead of leaving me to randomly stumble over it. But it's there now, and I have responded there. - TexasAndroid 17:12, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

To your point, "it would have been really nice if you had bothered" to check the article and compared it to the userfied version prior to your speedy delete. In DRV not one editor agreed with you regarding your unilateral decision.
In reviewing the history on your talk page I am not comfortable posting comments on there. You have been accused of bias in the removal of some articles and comments. You've also deleted many comments from your talk page from editors that have found fault with your actions. I am more comfortable discussing this in a public venue and will copy this conversation there. Drew30319 17:56, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
  • In further reviewing your contributions I came across the following entry made on Biographies of living persons/Noticeboard. Based on your comments there I now realize that the "speedy delete" appears to be simply a mistake but not one based on bad faith. The "threats" that I received from the anonymous user I will chalk up to coincidence and I apologize for the misunderstanding. I hope that you can see how this might have appeared to me in light of the circumstances. That does not relieve me of any burden of being wrong but will hopefully cast it in the proper light. Drew30319 18:16, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Apology accepted. As for the situation on my talk page, check out this archives WP:ANI thread about that situation. As for me removing things, normally I do not. If you look through my talk archives you will see a number of disagreements handled there, and left plainly in the archives. The one situation is different. Would you want to leave totally false accusations of racism on your talk page, especially when the accuser refuses to listen to any sort of reasoned counter-arguments, and refuses to offer a shred of proof? If a user started repeatedly falsely accusing you of racism, in inflamitory language, on your talk page, would you want it to stay there? The accusations are false, and I do not want such totally false accusations to stay on my talk page to prevent exactly the sort of false impression you have gotten about me. - TexasAndroid 18:30, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Hemlock Martinis blocked my account on the basis of false evidence.[edit]

The account User:R-1441 is my account. I made a comment on the behalf of Devraj5000. I have no interest in atheism or articles related to atheism.

The account was blocked by Hemlock Martinis on the basis of false evidence. Help me to unblock the account. Thank You. Ravi. RaviJames 02:56, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Hmmmmm... This was that account's first contribution. The block for sockpuppetry seems appropriate. Grandmasterka 03:02, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Check out that contribution list. Complainant blocked indef. Grandmasterka 03:05, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

OT: What a terrible name..Hemlock Martinis. Polounit 03:36, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

If by "terrible" you mean "excellent". ;-) Grandmasterka 04:00, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

I blocked Devraj5000 for a 3RR violation. The block was set for 24 hours. After doing so, R-1441 performed the exact same disruptive edits as Devraj5000 (that is, removing another user's scathing comments of Devraj5000 in the AfD discussion about List of atheist Nobel laureates). A user filed this, so I blocked R-1441 indefinitely and extended Devraj5000's block to a week. I was then browsing ArbCom pages due to my curiousity in the CharlotteWeb case, when I came across this edit. Seeing only the headline, I thought it was a remnant of my disputes with Giano and El C in the first week in June, but was quickly surprised to find out otherwise. That was my first notification of the complaint; Ravi notified every member of ArbCom and then Jimbo before even talking to me. Ravi has proceeded to badger me and numerous other editors, even resorting to personal attacks comparing me to Hitler, all in a campaign to order that his block be removed. I will not do so. I have absolutely no doubt in my mind that RaviJames and R-1441 and Devraj5000 are accounts by the same person. I stand by my block. --Hemlock Martinis 04:20, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Hemlock Martinis, I (as non-admin) agree with your assessment and actions. RaviJames was forum shopping on this and wouldn't accept the answers he was given by numerous people. He was cruising for a block which I see Grandmasterka gave. Flyguy649 talk contribs 04:26, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Even if the story is 100% true, for our purposes meatpuppets = sockpuppets. Therefore, block = good. — Scientizzle 15:21, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Do not be fooled by the terms. "Meat" and "socks" are made of the same material. They are all made of plastic and all smell like plastic. There are no fibers and no flesh indeed. -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 15:53, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

A User:Danny Daniel sock that needs blocking[edit]

PlotCrock (talk • contribs • deleted contribs • nuke contribs • logs • filter log • block user • block log) fit the pattern of the sockpuppets listed at User:Squirepants101/Danny Daniel. The username is in CamelCase. Some of the pages he recreated are just hoaxes may have been created by past Danny Daniel socks, including Carl and Earl (check the first version of the page to confirm this). Adds fake info that's related to the Jibbert Michart Macoy hoax. Uploaded an image that appears to have been made in MS Paint. Pants(T) 04:09, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

  • Based on the articles and the verbiage of the content therein, it looks like recreated Danny Daniel material. I've blocked under the Disruptive "throwaway" account used only for a few edits clause which states checkuser is not necessary, but if anyone wants to request one to confirm the sockpuppetry, no harm in it. --Kinu t/c 06:15, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Can someone look at Grandta Logan (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · page moves · block user · block log)? I think this is yet another sock of Danny Daniel. Wildthing61476 15:57, 12 July 2007 (UTC)


He's (apparently) baa-ack! Could an admin please take a look at the sock report? His disruptions of Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/John C. Bambenek are getting... verbose. Again. :-/ — Coren (talk) 04:13, 12 July 2007 (UTC)


This user appears to be operating a "Disruptive throwaway account" used only for a few mass deletions and accusations. Out of a total 62 edits, 55 were used making false accusations against myself. The other 7 were making mass deletions of long-standing material to the Shakespeare Authorship Question article. The reasons seem to be as follows: 1) User is a staunch Stratfordian who has stated that the article in question shouldn't even exist. He has made several mass deletions of well referenced material.[24], [25], [26], [27] 2) Because I restored this material, the user has made personal attacks, false accusations and went so far as to make erroneous reports to over a dozen administrators.[28], [29], [30] For full disclosure I have allowed myself to be dragged into 2 edit wars/3Rs, for which I have great regret. In each case it was because staunch stratdordians were making mass deletions of properly referenced materials. I believe this user is again trying to draw me into a 3R revert. Instead, I am keeping my edits light and I am coming here for help.

I request this user be blocked or banned, whatever you feel is appropriate based on the behaviour and the pure mean-ness involved. Thanks for your consideration. Smatprt 06:16, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

I claim that the user Smatprt is acting in the Shakespeare Authorship without consensus and for the past year has taken complete ownership of the article. He has already been blocked twice for 3RR violation [[31]][[32]] and he has a reputation for non-consensus in his editing on other forums. For example, on 13 May 2007 we find under the Shakespeare heading that "Smatprt is trying to delete all the arguments and information from Kathman's site while retaining all material published by non experts in non-scholarly, purely commercial presses" [[33]] and this one from a google search "You might like to take a quick look at the Shakespeare plays, where a certain Smatprt has taken it upon himself to perform mass restoration of the tags ..." [[34]]. It is his custom when confronted to file a report on the Administrator's noticeboard blaming his accuser. The following example resulted in no block.[[35]] There is also evidence that he is operating under a sockpuppet BenJonson (see Shakespeare Authorship discussion). You might like to obtain the testimony of the following users mandel, barryispuzzled, Paul_Barlow, alabamaboy. I should like to see a substantial block inforced. (Felsommerfeld 11:44, 12 July 2007 (UTC))
Actually, I believe I have filed, at most, 2 or 3 reports in the last 12 months. Each was on an editor who was making mass deletions of referenced material, and then edit warring (like Felsommerfeld and hangemhigh) to keep their deletions intact. Your edits are similiar - deletions of material without any discussion - and that is the cardinal rule around here I thought. Regarding the Kathman edits, please refer to the William Shakespeare page discussion, as Kathman's website has indeed been declared NOT a reliable source. REgarding your 3 referenced users - Barry and Paul have certainly proven just as argumentative and controversial, however Alabamaboy, being a respected administrator, probably has the best outlook on this. BTW - in spite of being told by several non-aligned editors that I am no sockpuppet, Felsommerfeld is still making unfounded accusations. I think this speaks volumes.Smatprt 13:54, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Sneaky vandalism[edit]

I'm the main contributing editor of the Peter Nordin page. I have been trying to develop that page as well as related content pages for about a month. But I have a few editors who have been stalking me, posting numerous tags, deleting content based on misinterpretation of rules, engaging in revert wars to keep their tags in place, etc. - basically doing a lot to hinder the process. User:N has engaged in the most harassment, and has just reverted two tags that were deleted; after I waited some time for a response to RfC on the tags. One is clearly harassment: he claims a profile is "written like a resume" because he finds some overlap between information in a profile about a notable professional person and information that can be found in a resume. The fact that both contain information about a person's career seems to escape him - but the rude fact is that The tag plainly contains the suggestion of a conflict of interest - with a link directly to that - as if it's a self-biography: which it is not. The second tag (sections) amounts to a poorly expressed POV, but User:N demands that it remains. With weeks of experience with User:N, it is clear that the intent is to be forceful rather than collaborative. (See final paragraph below.)

User:N previously made a false sockpuppet accusation (in archive) and made it stick with additional false information (that one's still not cleared up, as the admins who checked it made it clear they weren't interested in the facts or the rules - another story?). He then immediately used the accusation to discredit me in a dispute about the use of a fair-use image on the page's discussion page (archived). User:N has stalked me to the point of finding my comments in other discussions - for example, when I tried to discuss biography classifications at the biography portal, and was rudely interferring. User:N also redirected stubs for pages on individual robots (Elvis_(robot), Elvina_(robot), Priscilla_(robot)) to a project site, rather than allow for development of the pages. This seems supported by User:Nadav1, who is himself a self-appointed overseer of all the pages that I work on. I accepted the redirect, at least temporarily, because all the extra work of battling these guys has not left me with time to work on them. But redirection rather than remaining as a stub, eliminates the possibility that another editor (maybe there's one out there interested in these robots) might become interested.

User:Mats Halldin is also engaging in the fun - finding his way around to the pages I have worked on and those I have tried to get going. (You'll also find his editing at Peter Nordin, for example.) He's started a notability challenge going at Institute_of_Robotics_in_Scandinavia_AB. This was an "under construction" page until he removed the "under construction" tag and placed the notability challenge tag in its place. I've spent so much time working against these hinderences that I did not have time to work on the construction of this page. So, now I've placed a stub tag on it instead. I've tried to discuss the situation with User:Mats Halldin on the talk page, but he made a rude comment in response and put his tag back on the page.

On the Peter Nordin page, these two editors have deleted 41 references to relevant published material (citing a rule that did not match) and a list of corporate spin-offs (common to this type of article) - and now complain that the article content may not have sufficient supporting references.

The aim of these editors seems to be to delete page content until articles are insufficient to remain, or simply to place so many hinderances in the path so that new pages cannot be created successfully. They have not been collaborating / contributing on the development of any of the articles; merely throwing up road blocks and bullying. My attempts to reason with them have always met with the same attitude in response. They regard themselves as superior editors, letting me know that I am inferior and must do what I'm told.

--Rogerfgay 09:25, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Calling other editors "sneaky vandals" is not very good practice. From what I can see, the Peter Nordin article really does need a lot of work on tone, and is written much like a CV. The tag will help call attention to other editors who will help to fix it. Don't be offended by maintenance tags, they help attract attention to needed work. Seraphimblade Talk to me 10:43, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Rogerfgay has engaged in tireless antagonizing of anyone who criticizes or suggests improvements for the Peter Nordin article... (see the talk page where he's filed a ridiculous 4 RFCs, mostly over basic cleanup tagging). I would suggest anyone use extreme caution when listening to his version of events. --W.marsh 13:49, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Let's not forget the big stink over the Nordin image at WP:FUR: [36]. howcheng {chat} 16:49, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Blocked editor evading block using a sockpupppet account[edit]

Uber-troll Dragong4 (talk • contribs • deleted contribs • nuke contribs • logs • filter log • block user • block log), who has also edited under the permanently blocked Zabrak (talk • contribs • deleted contribs • nuke contribs • logs • filter log • block user • block log) is continuing to edit/troll/vandalise/npa under the new account - Zephead999 (talk • contribs • deleted contribs • nuke contribs • logs • filter log • block user • block log). User has not refrained from uncivil trolling, personal attacks and vandalism which got his other accounts blocked. 10:34, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

I believe this is correct, but from past experience trying to evaluate suspected sock puppets of banned editors, it is difficult to be certain. The similarity of this diff by Zephead999 and this diff by Dragong4 is a strong indicator of pattern vandalism. Shalom Hello 17:07, 12 July 2007 (UTC)


User:Jojopie User:Rotflmao User:Dodopie User:Fofopie User:Jewb User:JEWB SUCKS!!!!

All seem to be related, in that they all have similar user pages or (my mistake — only one has a userpage) are editing each other's pages and have similar edits (vandalism varieties on the form 'u have lupus'). It's not entirely benign, either, as both Jojopie and Dodopie have already got vandalism warnings (Dodopie is up to a last warning from me). Rotflmao's only edit is to Dodopie's user page (diff). What should I do, if anything? Angus Lepper(T, C, D) 11:16, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Not sure if these are related: user:Jewb, user:JEWB SUCKS!!!!. Maybe time for a checkuser, they all seem to be vandalising only. --Dirk Beetstra T C 11:25, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Ah, I noticed them earlier but forgot about them. I'll have a go at writing them all up for a case at Suspected Sockpuppets, I guess. Angus Lepper(T, C, D) 11:46, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
A suspected sockpuppetry case has been opened with respect to several of the above users. Evidence, comments and conclusions may be seen at Wikipedia:Suspected sock puppets/Dodopie. Angus Lepper(T, C, D) 12:54, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Suspected sockpuppets of Hardouin[edit]

The has been an active contributor to Paris-based articles for over two years now, but has profited from the low-contributor input on the same to force certain inventive propos of his own as fact. The right or wrong of this doesn't matter here; my concern is this contributor's habit of knee-jerk revert-warring to "protect" his propos (in ingnorance of all reason and references) in any way possible, even resorting to sockpuppetry to get "his word" in place. One can also add calculated slander and other manipulative behaviour to the list.

The list of suspected sockpuppets can be found at Category:Suspected_Wikipedia_sockpuppets_of_Hardouin. All have at one time or another reverted to 'to the letter' former versions written by User:Hardouin, and one of these has even been blocked after breaking (circumventing? Don't remember) the WP:3RR rule to 'protect' the same. Most of this revolves around the use of one term, and changes are most always to the same.

The list of coincidences is too overwhelming - how can a newly-registered user come to one page only hours after an edit to the same to revert it to a former version written... by someone else? And this repeatedly, to the same articles? One of these puppets have been proven with the help of User:Green Giant and an admin, but the rest are similar to a point of being far beyond suspect. Cheers. THEPROMENADER 11:29, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

I'm going to cross-post this at Wikipedia:Suspected sock puppets/Hardouin (which does not yet exist). I need to see all the userlinks lined up before I can evaluate the allegations. Shalom Hello 12:32, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Good luck, folks. This appears to be a very complicated case. Shalom Hello 12:52, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Dwrules (talk • contribs • deleted contribs • nuke contribs • logs • filter log • block user • block log)[edit]

Does this warrant talkpage protection? He's been going along the same, multi-{{unblock}}, trolly, POINTy path that his sockpuppets have gone along.--Rambutan (talk) 12:04, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Yes, you can protect the talk page. He clearly shows no signs of remorse or cooperation, and the diff counts as a personal attack. Shalom Hello 12:12, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

I can't; I'm not an admin! Could someone else?--Rambutan (talk) 12:15, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Wait guys. This report doesn't prove anything. Most probably he was playing w/ all those socks but isn't this IP hailing from Southampton, Britain instead of France? Could it be the case of someone trolling on his account? I haven't fallowed this case but maybe you can correct me. -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 12:19, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

The thing is, the name "France" doesn't imply that he's French, first of all. Now, Dwrules' excuse for having the same IP address as a known Doctor Who sockpuppeteer who gripes a lot about being blocked and uses {{unblock}} far too much was that he bought a computer. This is really lame, not least since a physical computer doesn't affect the IP address. They all exhibit very similar behaviour. And, three or four admins have all agreed this, so it seems that he is a sock. Anyway, personal attacks after blocking are a bit rich, and as for someone hacking his account: they've got the same (poor) writing style as him!--Rambutan (talk) 12:23, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Fair enough though i don't know why CU could neither deny nor confirm the sockpuppetry. I am not sure if the CU tool is efficient in terms of accuracy and speed of dealing w/ request especially that usually there are only a dozen each time. But that's another story. -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 13:02, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Quack quack. Will (talk) 14:01, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Well, quite. So could we protect his page?--Rambutan (talk) 15:20, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

It's OK, Riana's protected it. Thanks, everyone.--Rambutan (talk) 16:02, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Michaelbarnett72 (talk · contribs)[edit]

Resolved: See below.

This user contributes primarily to try and promote his own 'record company' (which in turn seems to simply promote his own unreleased records). His article on his 'label' Pro-Active Recordings has been deleted before in Jan 07 (see Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Pro-Active Recordings) and as such, given no notability in the revised version, i placed a speedy delete tag on it.

The user keeps removing the tag {{db-repost}} from the top of his page, against WP rules (and the instructions in the box). He has done this 6 times today, despite warning.

Would it be possible for his User ID and IP ( to have a temporary block put upon it to allow this AfD discussion to occur please? I imagine a day or two would be sufficient?

Many thanks

Owain.davies 13:55, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

For now this seems to be a stale issue. The page has been deleted as CSD G4, and the user has not recreated it again, nor has he made any other edit since July 8. A block is not necessary. Shalom Hello 17:00, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Vandal/Sock of SummerThunder (?) needing a block (not currently active)[edit]


I noticed a couple of my watchlisted pages had SummerThunder sockpuppet tags changed to indicate that they are now socks of established users [37], [38] by Ska2kd (talk • contribs • deleted contribs • nuke contribs • logs • filter log • block user • block log). I've reverted these and Ska2kd's other contributions. I'd normally take this to WP:AIV, but all the vandalism was from several hours ago. Cheers, Flyguy649 talk contribs 14:24, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

  • Indef blocked, thanks. NawlinWiki 14:35, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Warned for now. I am almost sure the account will get blocked as well as the only purpose of its existence on earth is tagging socks. Let's give it a few minutes and see. -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 14:38, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
    • I protected the user pages, too. I think protecting the user pages of tagged sockpuppet pages for him is going to need to be standard practice. -- Gogo Dodo 15:39, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

I'm having trouble getting completely rid of a shock image[edit]

Resolved: image deleted locally and on Commons. Fvasconcellos (t·c) 14:48, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

So a user, now indeffed, posted welcomes with a shock image to several new user talk pages. The image is deleted, but when I look at the diffs of the pages, I can still see the image. I'm trying to delete those versions of the pages, but I'm confused about why I can still see the image in the diffs. Shouldn't it be a redlink? I don't think the new user's he posted it to should have this in their talk page history. Do not look at the diffs if you are not in the mood to be totally grossed out User's contribs: Dina 14:26, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

A cache issue? Fvasconcellos (t·c) 14:29, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
oh dear, perhaps. Dina 14:30, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Not unless it's a server cache, because I could see it, too (suicide victim--horrible). These should be expunged. Why not delete these new user's pages? Flyguy649 talk contribs 14:32, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

I am suspecting that the users this user was welcoming are jut socks. Al lof them got a 0 contribs till this moment. -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 14:32, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Not Nice. Not a local cache issue. File is at commons - is this the issue?Pedro |  Chat  14:33, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Yes. Must be deleted there. I suggest contacting an admin with rights over there as well and deleting those revisions under CSD G3. Fvasconcellos (t·c) 14:35, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
How do you tell if an image is on commons? Dina 14:42, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Um, quite easily apparently. Dina 14:43, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
I've requested speedy deletion and notified the Commons AN. Fvasconcellos (t·c) 14:44, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Thanks, I just checked and it's gone there now. Dina 14:46, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Welcome. I've gone through and deleted some of those... "tainted" revisions. Fvasconcellos (t·c) 14:48, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

User:RJ CG - single-purpose account for edit warring?[edit]

RJ CG (talk · contribs) (previously (talk · contribs)) seems to be a single-purpose account created for edit warring and (occasionally racist) POV pushing ([39], [40]).

He is constantly using threatening edit summaries or calling other editors vandals and their edits vandalism ([41], [42], [43], [44], [45], [46], [47], [48], [49]).

Furthermore, he also often violates copyright guidelines by pasting material from various copyrighted sources (for example, [50] is from [51], [52] is from [53]). It seems that quite often he doesn't actually read his own sources before pasting text from them - or editing something, claiming it is not supported by sources ([54] (my edit), [55]).

User has been repeatedly warned - and before registering also blocked. His edits are a long list of reverts, repeatedly violating 3RR in progress.

Sander Säde 14:52, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

User PDTantisocial[edit]

I just blocked this user. There was a discussion here. A request to the user was posted at User_talk:PDTantisocial#Fair use rationale. The user's response is here. Since the most recent activity was incivility directed at me, I wanted a second opinion on the block to make sure it is reasonable. The block was primarily a preventative measure due to the user's unwillingness to use proper fair-use rationales. PDTantisocial was persistently violating WP:NFCC, and promised to continue violating it. This makes unnecessary extra work for others, whether they try to bring the image descriptions in line with policy or have the images removed. Sancho 15:53, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

  • I think an indefinite block is too severe because this is a productive editor (I scanned his contribution log) who happens to think the copyright policy of Wikipedia is overly stringent. This is his third block, and I understand the idea of "three strikes you're out." However, if I were making the call, I would have chosen a very long definite block - say, a month or two - and if he's still interested then, he can get one last chance to follow the rules. Shalom Hello 16:56, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Okay, I can lessen it to a shorter definite block. The reason I chose indefinite was to leave it up to the editor to decide how long the block would last by letting them indicate that they will change their behaviour. I'll wait around for maybe one more comment before shortening the block. Sancho 18:06, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
    • And yes, I agree that he is very productive when not uploading images. I want to stop this editor from editing for the smallest amount of time possible. Sancho 18:30, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

User:STEALTH RANGER being disruptive and uncivil[edit]

Could another administrator block STEALTH RANGER (talk · contribs) for disruption, incivility, and personal attacks? I would do it myself, but he seems convinced that I'm on a power trip and am the only one finding his behaviour inappropriate. He got upset when I removed a fair use image on his user page,[56] and then when I made some legit modifications to articles he visited.[57] [58] Diffs:

  • General disruptive behavior: [59] [60] [61] [62] [63]
  • Personal attacks/insults: [64] (Apparently a Klingon insult) [65] [66] [67] (This is with respect to my university's user box, which only says I am "affiliated" with my university)
  • Threats: [68]
  • Incidents where he compares me to Hitler or the Nazis: [69] [70]

He has been warned for personal attacks already[71] and shows no real intent to stop insulting anyone who disagrees with him. This type of incivility and abuse is ridiculous.-Wafulz 16:35, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

My, that is a lot of incivility. I've left a message at his userpage with a pretty clear set of diffs as to what about his behavior is unacceptable. I tried to be concise, certainly most of the above diffs could be substituted as examples of unacceptable discourse; to me at least the selective editing of Wafulz's comments is the most serious matter. I'd like to see his response to this warning. Continued actions along this vein will be grounds for blocking.--Isotope23 17:45, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Just an addendum: This type of behaviour isn't limited to me- it's basically anyone that "crosses" him. After the result of Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of Superhero Captains, he added this to his user page. He's been extremely hostile since he started here (take this and this as evidence).-Wafulz 17:55, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Safavid dynasty[edit]

Can anyone, please, mediate or check the edits on Safavid dynasty page. It's impossible to do any form of research or contribution to this article, because of User:Hajji Piruz and User:AlexanderPar, acting in tandem. The latter simply removes [72], the sourced material, citing disagreement with one reference and removing two as well as innocent translation of the title to a related language. It takes time to pull out the references and contribute to the article and User:AlexanderPar does not demonstrate any good faith or willingness to discuss. Please, also check Talk:Safavid dynasty for edits by User:Hajji Piruz and contributed quotes by myself, which are just impossible to integrate into article due to this POV/OR obstruction of any effort to contribute resources. Atabek 16:44, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Willingness to discuss? I have been discussing the issue on the talk page[73], Timurids and Ilkhanids were Mongols, and not related to Safavids at all, so that quote is irrelevant, and inaccurate.AlexanderPar 17:01, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
You have removed two sources from the article, not just Oberling. Discussion is usually two-ways, meaning you wait for response or read and come to agreement, not immediately go to editing the article. It's impossible to edit the article in this way, so that's why the attention of ANI is needed. I will not touch this article, which is turned into POV/OR mess, until administrators or arbitrators resolve the issue with certain contributors trying to obstruct the contributions and research on topics. Atabek 17:05, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
When I see an inaccuracy, I correct it, after providing a rational on discussion page. It's an undisputed fact that Ilkhanids were Mongols. Please assume good faith, and do not make accusations like "AlexanderPar is acting in tandem with X or Y" or "AlexanderPar does not demonstrate any good faith". Thanks. AlexanderPar 17:13, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
General comment: Part of the dispute, as I see it, is regarding the inclusion of the translation of the title. Translations should only be included if the alternate-language translation is directly relevant to the subject (e.g., in the article for Munich, the German equivalent is provided). If there is no such direct relevance (as "innocent translation iof the title to a related language" implies), translations into alternate languages should not be included. I do not know how that principle applies in this case. -- Black Falcon (Talk) 17:05, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
That principle does apply in this case, Safavids are a famous dynasty of Persia, their official court language was Persian, and they are regarded universally as sovereign monarchs of Persia, so the modern Azerbaijani language is quite irrelevant in this case, as the country of Azerbaijan was not established for centuries after Safavids' fall.AlexanderPar 17:23, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
As the page clearly shows, the dynasty was Azerbaijani-speaking, originated from Azerbaijan, first came to power in Azerbaijan, used Azerbaijani as its court language, and has relevance to Azerbaijani history as ruled on the territory of this country as well. Again due to obstructions and POV/OR pushing it's impossible to present impartial evidence to support any form of editing on this article, as even sourced material is being simply reverted or removed without proper discussion. Atabek 17:29, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

As far as I can tell, this matter does not require any administrative intervention. There is no edit warring (yet) that would require protection and no actions that justify a block. I recommend continuing discussion on the article's talk page and, if necessary, pursuing dispute resolution. -- Black Falcon (Talk) 17:57, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

The user is clearly removing sourced material from the article, and taking advantage of the fact that he is not (yet) restricted by ArbCom parole. Does there need to be a revert war to see this and ask the contributor to respect others' opinions? How about research time it takes to find references and contribute to articles? Atabek 18:18, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

User: posted someone's phone number on Wikipedia[edit]

Resolved: IP vandal blocked, diff removed. Black Falcon (Talk) 17:50, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

See this diff. Can the diff be deleted entirely? Joie de Vivre° 17:38, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

  • I've deleted it, and I'll request that it's oversighted. Cheers, WilyD 17:49, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
    • I blocked the IP for 24 hours and have bookmarked his/her contributions page to monitor potential future vandalism. -- Black Falcon (Talk) 17:50, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Apparent Muslim anti-Israel POV pusher at the current events portal[edit]

Given the prominence of Portal:Current events, this is a rather urgent matter. There is currently an anti-Israel POV pusher at Portal:Current events/Sidebar, who insists on adding "Israel's nuclear program" to the sidebar with no reason. It currently isn't a current event, nor is it being actively discussed worldwide. See also. The name of the user, Fâtimâh bint Fulâni (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · edit filter log · block user · block log), suggests that the user is Muslim (see bint). She has been warned about it, and this is fast becoming a POV revert-war. Admin intervention required. Chacor 14:37, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

See this message. The fact that the user emphasises that this were her first edits (and yet seems to have a good grasp of NPOV) is highly suspicious to me, because no user would emphasise "notice these are my very first edits", as if that clears them of any policy violation. Chacor 15:20, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
Further, and in contradiction of WP:AGF but following the doctrine of WP:DON'T AGF WHEN IT'S A BLATANT SOCK the user page seems rather elaborate and well structured for a self proclaimed newbie. Pedro |  Chat  15:33, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
I would like to point out that it might be possible the user has been active in other language variants of wikipedia before registering and editing here. There is not enough evidence that would warrant sockpuppet suspicion, I could not find "similar" edits by other editors that are now blocked or something. --TheDJ (talkcontribs) 18:04, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

It is rude to talk behind someone's back.--Fâtimâh bint Fulâni 16:53, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

To TheDJ - Yes, you are very right. My apologies to Fâtimâh bint Fulâni for my lack of faith. As regards to talking behind someone's back it's a pity that Chacor did not notify you that this was being brought to ANI but I believe his/her initial request for intervention still stands. Pedro |  Chat  19:52, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Yes I am active on the Spanish Wikipedia. Are there any major differences in this version?--Fâtimâh bint Fulâni 00:25, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Also, what does my faith have to do with this? What a silly poisoning of the well.--Fâtimâh bint Fulâni 21:19, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

British monarchy edit war[edit]


added by HappyFarmerofAsparagus 20:39, 11 July 2007 (UTC) -->

There seems to be a long-going edit war on this page; at least one of the editors has been warned several times before for edit warring there. Both are now at 3RR point - for the umpteenth time.--Rambutan (talk) 17:58, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

I've blocked G2bambino for 24 hours as he was warned for the same thing two days ago. I've warned Lonewolf BC as he's received no warnings. Ryan Postlethwaite 18:07, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
Scrap the above, I've blocked Lonewolf BC as well now as he had been warned but removed the warnings. Ryan Postlethwaite 18:11, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

in addition, some vandal fiddled with a couple related articles.