Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/IncidentArchive870

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WP:HOUNDING and disruptive tagging of Boko Haram[edit]

We have a number of charges here. One is that Legacypac's tagging is disruptive and unfounded. I find no evidence of that. It is not easy for a drive-by admin to judge what the POV issues are, but for now, this is a content matter that needs to be dealt with on the article talk page, and not at ANI. One may quibble over how many tags are necessary, but even a quick reading shows that copy edits certainly need to be made.

The countercharge, that Signedzzz is a kind of SPA exerting ownership over the article to its detriment, is asserted but not sufficiently proven by a large enough number of uninvolved editors to warrant a topic ban or a block. I do recognize that there are concerns over Signedzzz's editing here, esp. the edit warring, but I do not see that these are such that they cannot be dealt with at ANEW, for instance.

My suggestion to the involved editors is indeed that they seek more editors to get involved: if you read over this very thread you will realize, perhaps, that the lack of editors commenting in this thread is one of the reasons I cannot, as an administrator, establish that there is a consensus for this or that action. Same with POV tags and discussions: you all need more eyes (and fewer words, for economy is a virtue). I suggest well-advertised RfCs on relatively small issues that can help settle the specific disputes. And that is all I can do here. Drmies (talk) 03:43, 20 January 2015 (UTC)

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

User:Legacypac placed neutrality and factual accuracy tags on Boko Haram 8 January. His justification, at Talk:Boko_Haram#POV_Issues, was that 4 facts were supposedly missing from the article. If they were in fact missing, this would not justify the tags, since he could simply have added any sourced facts. In the same article talk page section he accuses me, with no explanation, of having an (unspecified) agenda; this edit he made to ANI (with edit summary "not going to allow any more unsubstantiated personal attacks"), where he angrily deletes a comment by another user about him having an agenda, shows that he is fully aware that making an unsubstantiated accusation of having an agenda is a personal attack.

His other reason, on the same talk page section, is "I noticed that what at first glance looks like a chronologically of events is actually a jumble. Agree with just year by year (or range of years if obvious breaks exist)." The chronology of events is, in fact, in chronological order, as made obvious by the year-be-year subheadings that have recently been added. Saying "or range of years if obvious breaks exist" indicates that he doesn't actually have any idea if what he is claiming is true, since he hasn't bothered to read the article to find out.

I have been unable to ascertain any valid reason for the "multiple issues" tag (eg. a fact that is inaccurate). On 10 January I removed the tags again ("redundant tags"). User:Legacypac restored the tags stating "restore tags to get additional editor attention here. User was blocked, partly for taking these tags off again", referring to this edit-warring report (the third he had filed against me in less than a week), where he refuses when asked to give any example of POV or factual inaccuracy, answering instead "I could ask questions or for diffs, but he would just blather on with more nonsense allegations and never answer the questions or justify them." The reason "to get additional editor attention here" still has nothing to do with POV or accuracy.

Also on 10 January, User:Legacypac added 2 more tags to the factual accuracy and neutrality "multiple issues" tag: "Added cleanup and copy edit tags (within multiple issues) to article". The new tags stated "This article may require cleanup to meet Wikipedia's quality standards. The specific problem is: reorganization underway-see talk." and "This article may require copy editing for grammar and capitalization especially".

In a section on the article talk page asking for reasons for the tags [1]. User:Lipsquid replied that the article has "an anti-Muslim and anti-Nigerian government bias". He backs this claim by complaining about a few sourced facts in the article that supposedly are biased, although they are exactly as they appear in the sources. So, I am now accused of having a POV "agenda" which is anti-everything. He also blames me for the existence of a "Name" section (which has nothing to do with me). User:Legacypac added an incoherent comment about the timeline, and states "These tags have brought in many new editors" - still not a reason for tags - he then makes a request at Wikipedia:Requests for page protection for the page to be protected. So, while his reason for tagging the article is purportedly to bring in new editors (a totally inadequate reason), he also feels the need to protect the article from new editors.

User:Lipsquid is a SPA who makes disruptive and disingenuous arguments when deleting sections, such as "The word "Boko Haram" is not in the reference you cited" when referring to a source that contains "Boko Haram" in the title and repeated throughout (Revolt in the North: Interpreting Boko Haram’s war on western education).

(A) Since I disagreed with him about unsourced material on another article, User:Legacypac has had an obsession with filing reports against me to the edit-warring noticeboard, generally when no 3RR violation has occurred (about half a dozen in the last few weeks). He has recently stepped up his campaign with an AN/I thread, as well as with the unexplained "multiple issues" article tag. With this edit in an unrelated thread on the ANI noticeboard, he announced his intention to get rid of me as an editor on Wikipedia, (or, to "deal with" me, whatever that means).

Since adding the tags, User:Legacypac has added a new completely unsourced section, Boko_Haram#Symbols, near the top of the page. His other smaller additions, mainly to the infobox, have similarly introduced factual inaccuracies, which I have now corrected, and explained in Talk:Boko_Haram#Factual_inaccuracies_added_to_infobox. As yet, no factual inaccuracies have been pointed out that existed before the "factual inaccuracy" and other tags were added.

This article, which had been relatively stable since I completed the history section several weeks ago, is very high-traffic and should not be subject to User:Legacypac's childish whims. The multiple issues tags are pointlessly disruptive solely in order to advance a personal vendetta. They have now been there for over a week, with absolutely no valid justification. zzz (talk) 12:46, 16 January 2015 (UTC)

  • Comment I have no idea what this is even about and, honestly, didn't read the whole thing, but it seems there should be a separate noticeboard just for complaints about Legacypac by this point. It's always the same thing, too - someone is alleging he's threatened to get rid of them, or report them to death, or whatever. I withhold any further comment, though. Maybe there's a multi-tentacled conspiracy out to make him look bad. (Stranger things have happened.) BlueSalix (talk) 13:54, 16 January 2015 (UTC)

I guess I must be part of the conspiracy. Legacypac and I both are on the Trilateral Commission and go to Bilderburger meetings in Area 51 to plan out the demise of other Wikipedia users. Please leave me out of any nonsense that involves crazy people. ZZZ asked what was wrong with the article on the talk page, so I told him on the talk page. I didn't edit anything, I didn't make any personal comments about him. I discussed inconsistencies and bias in the article. [redacted] Lipsquid (talk) 15:26, 16 January 2015 (UTC)

If terms like "crazy people" are being thrown around then obviously there is a problem of some type. I strike, and apologize for, my previous flippant comments. On further reading of Signedzzz's report this does seem to be a highly questionable sequence of edits delivered in a very charged fashion that is not WP:AGF and not WP:CIVIL. Further, the addition of the unsourced section "Symbols" is not consistent with WP:CS. These are not obvious facts, but expert assertions being made with no references, like "Two crossed Kalashnikov automatic rifles, model AK47. This is a common symbol with terrorist organizations and symbolizes armed struggle and the willingness to use violence." BlueSalix (talk) 17:18, 16 January 2015 (UTC)

Reply I'm glad Signedzzz filed this report for context is everything. [2] [3] [4] [5] [6]

The following report (linked above by Signedzzz) was archived automatically without action or comment while Signedzzz was on a 4 day block. He did not accept the proposed topic ban, so it goes to the community or an Admin to decide. I will not waste everyone's time responding to the unsubstantiated allegations above except to say that:

  1. Pending Changes Review was added by an Admin a few hours ago. That allows everyone to edit, but changes by editors who are brand new require review before going live. Reason was persistent vandalism by non-autoconfirmed editors.
  2. At (A) is he getting close to breaching his ISIL topic ban?
  3. A review of Boko Haram talk and changes log will show the rest of his complaints are nonsense and just part of his pattern of behavior that lead to User:EdJohnston proposing the topic ban.
  4. At BlueSalix - it is because I edit some contentious areas and am willing to report the problematic editors that these topics attract.

(Revived from Archives) Boko Haram Proposed Topic Ban[edit]

Related 3RR reports: [7], [8] and others.

A single editor is guarding the Boko Haram article like a junkyard dog, making it impossible for any other editor to make meaningful contributions. Since all efforts to reason are met with insults, WP:IDONTHEARTHAT and more edit warring, the only solution I can see it a community imposed topic ban for Boko Haram and all related topics.

Examples:

  1. [9] wholesale revert of changes by User:Koyos
  2. [10] remove POV and Factual tags added by User:Lipsquid and adjusted by User:Charles Essie
  3. [11] remove POV and Factual tags added by User:Legacypac
  4. [12] wholesale revert on changes to Names section by User:Legacypac
  5. [13] makes large edit with summary "(many unexplained changes to text)"
  6. [14] editwarring over Background section with same revert about 9 times. Results in 4 trips to 3RR board and a comment by User:EdJohnston that he believes Signedzzz will never stop.
  7. [15] removed word "men" from types of people (men, women and children) kidnapped in the lead and good source added by User:105.184.160.62
  8. [16] [17] [[18]]] reverted additions of ISIL under allies by User:Jurryaany, an IP, and User:Jackninja5. first time it is ref'd, second time he says it needs a ref, third time in breach of his ISIL topic ban, .
  9. [19] even undoes minor spelling variation by User:LightandDark2000
  10. [20] good addition by User:MelvinToast
  11. [21] took out timeline section, left article with only a link under see also
  12. [22] reverted the addition of "nearly" by User:Shii in front of an approximation of refugees.

And if you go back further there are more examples.

User contribution tool found an astonishing 2443 edits by User:Signedzzz on Boko Haram (54.75% of the total edits made to the page).

Just as I am finishing this report I see the post below on 3RR, which may solve the problem. However, since I did all the work to put the report together I'm putting this up anyway to call editors attention to the problem with the Boko Haram article and as a back-up of information to support a topic ban imposed by the community or an Admin.Legacypac (talk) 04:53, 10 January 2015 (UTC)

(Quoted here) Stop x nuvola with clock.svg Blocked – Signedzzz is blocked four days for long-term edit warring at Boko Haram, as well as a 3RR violation on 8 January. The closure of this complaint was delayed due to discussions which took place both here and in a report above. It appeared for a while that Signedzzz was agreeing to take a break from the article, but he made this controversial edit on 10 January which removes article tags, showing that he has not stopped editing at Boko Haram. This block can be lifted if Signedzzz will accept a topic ban from Islamic extremism and Boko Haram, which will apply everywhere on Wikipedia on articles, talk pages and noticeboards. Signedzzz is already banned from editing on WP:GS/SCW per an earlier complaint. EdJohnston (talk) 03:25, 10 January 2015 (UTC) (end Quote) (end of repost of ANi report of 10 January 2015 Legacypac (talk) 00:27, 17 January 2015 (UTC))

Discussion[edit]

That's fine, but I'm not sure how it excuses some of the language that was being thrown around or the insertion of a large quantity of uncited material. Also, having now read the diffs you've posted above, I - in some cases - question the accuracy of the summaries you've offered of these interactions, while - in others - fail to see the problem of the edits. This diff [23] for instance you've characterized as a "wholesale revert" of your edits, but it appears the only substantive edits were to remove those of your insertions that were sourced to non-RS sources like something called "gotdns.com" and a primary source reference to wikileaks. BlueSalix (talk) 17:28, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
A (very) cursory can of Signedzzz's 54.75% total edits appears that a large percentage of them are minor copyediting that predate the emergence of Boko Haram as a topic of heavy media coverage. So, in my opinion, it doesn't seem that astonishing and, in fact, rather commendable. BlueSalix (talk) 20:29, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
  • EdJohnston, thank you for your action and comments. I would, however, like to place one note in the margin of the general discussion: OWNership is baaaad, of course, but that doesn't make zzz's work automatically invalid. Of course edit warring and removing valid tags and all that jazz are disruptive, but let's think about the baby before we throw it out with the bathwater: let's make sure that such an abortive move will not detract from article quality. (If it sounds like I'm breaking a lance for zzz, maybe--but I don't know them from Adam and have no involvement with the article.) I see that 1R was tried unsuccessfully at Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant, but perhaps it's worth having another go at 1R, or even 0R, before we throw another topic ban at zzz. Thanks, Drmies (talk) 17:49, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
  • With respect of zzz's edits, having only glanced at this page, it appears he's been on it for a long time. And it appears his concerns are justifiably centered on the insertion of large amounts of uncited material, or material cited to non-RS. I don't know if he's a SME or not, but banning him from this subject in favor of this other editor doesn't seem like it will result in the best possible article WP can produce on this subject. I'm not very close to this question so there may be some nuances on which I'm not picking up, but this is my bird's eye view. BlueSalix (talk) 17:54, 16 January 2015 (UTC)

Update: The OWNership continues as he just made several unconstructive edits that removed good additions made by a variety of editors while he was on the block, which appears to restores the lead and infobox to exactly how he had it before the block. [24] and [25]. Legacypac (talk) 17:53, 16 January 2015 (UTC)

  • I see now that I misunderstood--I thought Ed's commentary was on a current block. Here's the thing, though: I cannot immediately see from your diff that zzz is reverting (ie, edit warring), and I cannot right now look into it, since I gotta run. I urge another admin to look into the matter (Bbb23 are you up yet?). If it had been a clear revert or something like that I would have blocked for a week or more. Thanks for the note, Legacypac. Drmies (talk) 17:57, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
  • Your first diff shows he edited the contributions of an IP editor. Nothing against IP editors, but reverting or modifying edits contributed by an IP editor is usually not a smoking gun of ownership or disruptiveness, particularly on controversial topics as this one appears to be. A more careful look at this specific edit, as far as I'm concerned, also doesn't find any fault. Your second diff is to him editing his own edit. BlueSalix (talk) 18:00, 16 January 2015 (UTC)

I have never seen any other article get tagged for factual inaccuracy when every fact is cited, and no fact is claimed to be inaccurate at all. And the POV tag has not been explained either (what is my POV?) And I don't know how it fails Wikipedia's quality standards (the chronology is in chronological order, so it can't be that). Legacypac's original explanation was "to alert other editors and readers that there are [unspecified] problems here." But WP:TC says "Cleanup tags are meant to be temporary notices that lead to an effort to fix the problem, not a permanent badge of shame to show that you disagree with the article or a method of warning the readers against the article". Yesterday, 75,000 readers saw the tags, but only 165 looked at the talk page to see if there was a reason. If there is a reason, I'd just like to know what it is, so I can discuss it and help fix it. I can see how some of my actions might look a bit OWNery, so I'll be more careful. For a very long time, hardly any other editors contributed, and now, suddenly, after these tags which I don't understand, there's subheadings (some possibly non-neutral) over every paragraph or 2, and many photos of questionable value. And unsourced material, no discussion. zzz (talk) 18:51, 16 January 2015 (UTC)

I have no interest in owning this article (or any other). I got involved when I saw a content dispute and gave a 3rd opinion. This issue is less about any specific edit but that over many months Signedzzz has reverted every substantive edit by every other editor that comes along. This while excluding substantive info (like Boko Haram was designated a terrorist group by the UN Security Council under the AQ sanctions). The latest two deletions after the block reset multiple editors all at once. Finally I did not add the symbols section,, I presume Signedzzz added it but have not looked through his several thousand edits to confirm. Legacypac (talk) 21:00, 16 January 2015 (UTC)

How does complaining about the factual accuracy and POV Tags in the article while also complaining about the factual accuracy and POV issues in the article work? And most of the stuff Signedzzz is complaining about is stuff he put there originally.

EdJohnston's Quoted post above was in a 3RR report that he closed as the previous ANi was being posted by me (as noted). It has now been detached from the quoted ANi by Blue's insertions. (fixed now) That ANi went stale as Incapped it off with Ed's quote and Signedzzz could not respond while blocked and choose not to accept the topic ban proposed by EdJohnston for his edit warring. So now we are back to the edit warring issue and the OWN issue that lead to the 4 day block and proposed topic ban by EdJohnston. Hope this is clear and I hope User:EdJohnston will weigh in. He was aware of my 4 day back ANi and thanked me for posting it. Legacypac (talk) 21:34, 16 January 2015 (UTC)

I apologise, you merely [moved the unsourced "symbols" section up to the top of the article; I can't find where it was first added 3 hours before.
I can't think of any substantive edit, for months, reverted or otherwise. There was an edit that added a couple of subheadings to the end section, which I was grateful for, about a month ago. And a more recent edit at the end of the chronology, when I had n't edited for a while.
I certainly haven't "excluded" substantive info, or any other sort of info. I never got round to mentioning the UN, since there is nothing much substantive to say about them, apart from the mere fact of the terrorist designation. I did revert an edit in the lead about New Zealand designating them as terrorist, because I couldn't see how it was important enough, which I did explain to the editor.
"How does complaining about the factual accuracy and POV Tags in the article while also complaining about the factual accuracy and POV issues in the article work?" I've no idea what this means. My only complaint with the tags is that I haven't heard yet a justification. No inaccurate fact, for example. "And most of the stuff Signedzzz is complaining about is stuff he put there originally." What stuff that I put there are you saying I am complaining about? (Is that what you're saying?) zzz (talk) 22:31, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
  • Comment. I am commenting principally because Drmies asked me to. I'm not quite sure what the scope of the proposed topic ban is. Perhaps that should be clarified. However, most of zzz's latest comments above seem eerily similar to comments they've made before. I'm not going to dig up diffs for more recent problems because, athough I'm technically "up", my energy level is not. I do think that changing from 1RR to 0RR on Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant would create more problems than it solves and would be time-consuming to enforce. I also think it would require a separate discussion as it's part of a broader set of community sanctions.--Bbb23 (talk) 22:55, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
  • Per WP:ORR, 0RR is intended to be imposed on editors only, not articles. NE Ent 23:40, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
  • Thanks for the reminder. I always forget that sentence. Maybe it's because I'm not crazy about 0RR generally. Personally, I've seen it used most often as a restriction agreed to by a user in exchange for avoiding more serious sanctions. Then, of course, there is the recurring problem - but heightened - as to what constitutes a "revert".--Bbb23 (talk) 15:48, 17 January 2015 (UTC)

Brief History[edit]

  1. In response to the two most recent 3RR reports [26] [27], EdJohnston offered Signedzzz a 1 month self imposed break from Boko Haram on his talk page instead of sanctions.
  2. This offer was rejected by Signedzzz when he went back to edit warring.
  3. So I drafted up the January 10 ANi (reposted above) where I proposed a "community imposed topic ban for Boko Haram and all related topics," but as I was about to post it
  4. I found that EdJohnston had just issued a 4 day block and an offer "This block can be lifted if Signedzzz will accept a topic ban from Islamic extremism and Boko Haram, which will apply everywhere on Wikipedia on articles, talk pages and noticeboards. Signedzzz is already banned from editing on WP:GS/SCW per an earlier complaint. EdJohnston (talk) 03:25, 10 January 2015 (UTC)"
  5. Signedzzz did not agree to the topic ban, lived out the 4 day block, and went straight back to reverting other editors [28] [29], by restoring the infobox and lead basically to how he had them on January 6 before he was blocked and a bunch of other editors worked on the article without his OWNership getting in the way,
  6. filing this ANi against me and when challenged in this ANi,
  7. he posted combative stuff on the talk page [30] [31] and, after answers are provided there, comes back here and claims to one will explain the issues to him WP:IDONTHEARTHAT.

So I leave this in the capable hands of an Admin to deal with or we can vote on the topic ban as defined by EdJohnston. Legacypac (talk) 01:13, 17 January 2015 (UTC)

Everyone apparently seems to agree that the article has multiple issues. I still don't understand what they are. The talk page just has user lipsquid complaining that I repeated what sources say, and complaining there shouldn't be a "name" section (which I might agree with, but it doesn't explain why the article's so terrible), Talk:Boko_Haram#Article_tags, so that doesn't help. That's when I decided to come here in hopes of an explanation. I still haven't had one. But at least I know everyone agrees now. zzz (talk) 09:58, 17 January 2015 (UTC)

Never ending WP:IDONTHEARTHAT I doubt he will ever stop. Lipsquid (talk) 17:32, 17 January 2015 (UTC)

No, Ive stopped editing, dont worry. Like I said, I can see that everyone agrees the stuff i do has multiple issues which im not aware of. I just would have liked an explanation either on the talk page or the admins noticeboards where Ive asked for one, since the tags were added by someone who has made no secret of making it his mission to get rid of me. And someone else who calls me a "crazy person" and a "loon who thinks he owns the article" in his first reply here. Insults and catchphrases like IDONTHEARTHAT obviously trumps anything else, and I was idiotic to think I'd ever get an explanation. Which doesnt matter anyway since everyone else agrees. The stuff ive done just creates problems for other editors to sort out, so theres no point in me hanging around to get insulted any more. zzz (talk) 01:46, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
Just by the way, the journalist who links to my DYK article in this article doesnt seem to share the opinion of these editors about my mental faculties. There appears to be something else going on here, which i want no further part of — Preceding unsigned comment added by Signedzzz (talkcontribs) 02:25, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
And, thanks so much for your "support", User:Drmies, in summoning BBB, who was of course the admin who gave me my first 48 hours block with talk page access removed, for "violating 1RR" after 1 revert (ie, not violating 1RR), at Legacypac's behest, where I was not even allowed to respond to the report. (And I had not been given the General Sanctions notification, since it was my first edit to the article). zzz (talk) 03:23, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
I didn't call on Bbb to support you or attack you. I called on him because he's a good reader of edit warring diffs, and because he has looked at your file before--there was a distinct possibility that Bbb could look at those edits that were signaled here and determine if this was continuing the edit war or not. Now, if you wish to rehash a block from two months ago, do it somewhere else please. Drmies (talk) 03:39, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
Fine, except that (like my first block mentioned above) the edits signaled here just concern me disagreeing with Legacypac, which is plainly breaking a strictly enforced unwritten rule of Wikipedia. zzz (talk) 03:44, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
The last post looks like a violation of his SCW/ISIL topic ban, and the behavior highlighted there is much like the behavior highlighted here.
Editing wikipedia requires some WP:COMPETENCE in understanding sources and correctly reflecting them in the article. It requires not dismissing a link [32] between two terrorist organizations because the last source he found (and misrepresnted) was June 2014 [33]. or because in another source he can't see any mention of al-Qaeda even though pages 23-25 are headed External Links and Networks where we can read all about the links to AQ. In my estimation WP:COMPETENCE is lacking here, with this thread being the latest example.
ALthough he posts here sarcastically he is not editing at Boko Haram, he is at the same time posting stuff on the talk page. Legacypac (talk) 03:53, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
You asked me to reply to you, so I replied. No surprise really at this point that you find this worth complaining about. zzz (talk) 04:15, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
Speaking of competence, the Congressional report of June 2014 summarises its own position regarding Boko Haram's affiliation with Al Qaida, and that of the US govt, at the end of the first paragraph of the report thus: "The Obama Administration does not currently consider Boko Haram to be an affiliate of Al Qaeda." Legacypac repies "Quoting the first summary page is fine, as long as you don't cherry pick one sentence to get to a novel conclusion." He is quite literally stating that the report's own summary of its own conclusions is "cherry picking to get to a novel conclusion," and he instead reaches a different conclusion. And he describes this as a matter of "competence". Since Legacypac reverted my edit which he complains about above, the Boko Haram infobox again states that al Qaeda are "allies" - because on Wikipedia, User:Legacypac's opinion trumps the US government's. zzz (talk) 04:45, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

I would welcome any Admin or Editor to review the debate and make a ruling. The quote from the summary refers to AQ Core, but the report clearly suggests current links to AQIM and suggests other links. Legacypac (talk) 05:46, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

I suppose that you know you're right already, though, since you edit-warred to include your opinion in the infobox, although "The Obama Administration does not currently consider Boko Haram to be an affiliate of Al Qaeda" (since June 2014). Note that User:Legacypac edit-warred for the infobox to state that "Al Qaeda" are allies, not "AQIM", although, given the present scrutiny, he has now decided unilaterally to change it to "Al Qaeda via AQIM", a novel formulation of his own invention, still clearly in disagreement with the very clear position of the US govt (as of June 2014), but presumably a tacit acceptance that his edit-warring been wrong all along. The link with AQIM is possible to draw from the report of a US officer in February 2014. However, the Congressional report was from June 2014 - and you editwarred to include "Al Qaeda", not "AQIM", because you think you can ignore Reliable Sources. Which is strange, since you also edit warred to include a "factual inaccuracy" tag among the "multiple issues", and have still not indicated a single factual inaccuracy - in the entire (long) article, whereas out of your few additions, you are already editwarring to introduce blatant, obvious factual inaccuracies. zzz (talk) 06:01, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
Another obvious blatant example from the infobox: "Strength estimated at over 9000". The US govt Congressional report above gives the strength as "100s to 1000s", as stated and cited in the lead section. The Telegraph, which is cited in the infobox, says "up to 9000+"I read this source months ago and forgot the exact wording (for the record) "largest force 9000+". Which means "up to 9000, or perhaps more". Yet you edit warred for it to say "over 9000". Is this another factual inaccuracy, as I explained in the talk page, or am I WP:NOTHEARINGSOMETHING, again? It is another crystal clear example of User:Legacypac deliberately disregarding WP:RS and edit-warring to include his blatantly wrong opinions ("factual inaccuracies", as per the tag he added). And please note that he has only been WP:OWNing this article for a few days so far, and has hardly even got started yet. zzz (talk) 07:02, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
Another example: see end of this report. After the clear explanation there (and in my edit summary) of why I removed his addition, he just simply added it back, claiming "restore unexplained mass revert of changes to Names section" (emphasis added). zzz (talk) 08:53, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
  • Comment This sort of behaviour by LP was ongoing on the 2014 shootings at Parliament Hill, Ottawa article and on its talkpage. "Curiously" even though that talkpage was started on Oct 23, 2014 but the oldest archive of that page [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:2014_shootings_at_Parliament_Hill,_Ottawa/Archive_4begins at November 14....some discussions on the missing-from-the-archive talkpage were directly chronicling/document false/misleading edit comments and POVism by him on that article; some of my points about his behaviour are present in Archive 4, however. Post-striking out that previous bit, I had the numerical order of the archives wrong; I'll maybe come back with specific sections from Article 1, I've spent more time than I meant to today on this distasteful board; and I note he's trying to get a vote-call to block someone else who's pointing at his behaviour as a problem. Pot kettle black big-time.Skookum1 (talk) 10:22, 19 January 2015 (UTC)
  • Note also his ongoing archiving of this page - very curious for someone who is the subject of an open ANI here - and also his AGF and NPA in his redactions and removal of my vote from the voting section he started to seek having me blocked, not for any reason to do with the articles and discussions that that ANI, the purpose of which was actually mediation not punishment. He accuses me of "harassment" but that's exactly what he's doing towards me; I'm staying away from this page mostly, but upon seeing this ANI and what you're talking about re him his past behaviour on other "terror theme" articles is more than relevant; also re Talk:2014 Saint-Jean-sur-Richelieu ramming attack though to a lesser degree, but cheerleading there for another highly POV editor who fabricated what's not in sources and who, similarly, seems to be entirely agenda-driven on MidEast/terror articles. Look in his usercontributinos for yet more edit-warring and POV activity/ANIs about him in the past.Skookum1 (talk) 09:47, 19 January 2015 (UTC)

All hogwash, but bonus points for coming up with an accusation as unique as blaming me for the work of lower case sigma bot III. Legacypac (talk) 10:23, 19 January 2015 (UTC)

Well, I did strike that out once my error was pointed out to me by a more friendly editor than you have any intentions of ever being. Bonus points for your supposed business in BC...you must make a lot of money at it to spend all day, for weeks and weeks and months, wiki-warring here in Wikipedia about "terror" and pushing a certain POV about same. Other than re-heeding Viriditas' advice to me about ignoring this pile of "hogwash" that goes on here (otherwise known as "horseshit") and just keep working on articles; you do not have consensus to block me, trying so hard as you are; I'll be back with specific items on those archives for the benefit of those here who are observing much the same about you as myself and others have noted about you re Ottawa.Skookum1 (talk) 10:56, 19 January 2015 (UTC)

WP:COMPETENCE, WP:CIVIL and WP:NOTHERE issues continue[edit]

I just don't believe this. User:Legacypac has now deleted "membership estimated at 100s to 1000s", as per Congressional Research Service, saying "replace inaccurate and unsourced "few hundred to few thousand" members line with sourced statement for # of fighters", replacing it with "9000", cited to a source that says "unknown" and "lower estimate 500, higher estimate 9000". So he's replaced a correctly cited estimate with an incorrectly cited one. I don't understand why. And he's done the same in the infobox. He just has no idea about factual accuracy whatsoever. It's hopeless. It's surreal, he editwars to keep the factual inaccuracy warning, then insists on adding factual inaccuracies. I tried reasoning with him on article talk, Talk:Boko_Haram#Membership_number.2Ffighter_count, and he just told me to get stuffed. I don't know what else to do, except leave the article to collect enough factual inaccuracies to justify the warning tag. zzz (talk) 22:23, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
Total hogwash. Legacypac (talk) 22:38, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

"Unknown, lower estimate 500, higher estimate 9000" = "9000", according to Legacypac. Either he actually believes this (WP:COMPETENCE), or he thinks it's close enough for Wikipedia purposes (WP:NOTHERE). His protracted WP:HOUNDING, and deliberate disruption of this article, adding his POV factual inaccuracies, presumably in a bizarre attempt to justify the multiple issues warning tags he added, needs to be stopped. zzz (talk) 08:10, 19 January 2015 (UTC)

Short Summary[edit]

There were no factual inaccuracies before he started editing, and no misrepresentations of sources - not a single one has been pointed out by anyone. But Legacypac wants to get rid of the editor, and finds the article doesn't do a good enough job of promoting his POV, so he sticks multiple issues warning tags on it, with a completely ridiculous and false explanation (4 missing facts, "These tags have brought in many new editors"), then gets stuck in making any POV inaccurate edits he likes, sticking sources next to "facts" that misrepresent the sources (diffs above), ignoring inconvenient sources that state the opposite of other "facts" (diffs above), adding massive POV sections, and edit warring whenever necessary. Reverting his edits is not allowed (no consensus). So at this point, as is now a fairly well-accepted fact, all of Wikipedia's terrorism-related articles are User:Legacypac's personal blog, bearing little resemblance to any reliable sources. zzz (talk) 02:19, 20 January 2015 (UTC)

  • Comment - because of connectivity problems I haven't been able to explore the archives/history of the talkpage for the Ottawa shootings article where LP's conduct was very similar; he had in fact deleted and re-deleted a section on that talkpage about his false edit comments and POV edits and SYNTH assertions; it appears to have been deleted again before that page was archived. I have other things to do today, but I'm pointing out that his editing of others posts in talkpage discussions is against guidelines; and similarly he's doing that here on the vote-call he launched against me on this ANI. And who is he again? And why is he allowed to redact and remove others' posts, incite hostility towards them, invoke vote-calls and then editorialize on them? Finger-pointing away from himself is his tactic, very notable on the Ottawa page, per that repeatedly deleted listing of his miscreant edits/synth/pov work there. Skookum1 (talk) 03:11, 20 January 2015 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

User:173.50.161.119 disruptive edits[edit]

173.50.161.119 did a little bit of disruptive edits in 2010 and has now returned and done a bit more disruptive edits. Recent vandalism is shown here, here, and here. Perhaps a block is needed to stop this IP from further vandalizing articles. Andise1 (talk) 07:37, 20 January 2015 (UTC)

Welcome, but this is not place to report any vandal, you should report it at Administrator intervention against vandalism. Please read instructions when you start discussion. Thank you A.Minkowiski _Lets t@lk 07:53, 20 January 2015 (UTC)

Pardo[edit]

Please verify what is happening to the article Pardo and take the proper measures. I prefer to abstain from meta discussions and reporting users, but I'm tired of seeing their row on my Watchlist. -- Marawe (talk) 17:38, 19 January 2015 (UTC)

  • I've locked the article for ten days to give these truthseekers (I templated them for edit warring) time to work it out on the talk page. The version I locked is without the cute pictures. I imagine a population group of 82 million deserves a couple of pictures, but there are WP:BLP issues here, and only one of the warriors has sought the talk page. Good luck to them. Drmies (talk) 17:45, 19 January 2015 (UTC)
  • The history tells me this is actually older, and also involved are Khalel122 and Coltsfan. This needs to be hashed out on the talk page, with consensus to include for each and every individual picture based on ironclad references in the articles of those individuals. Drmies (talk) 17:48, 19 January 2015 (UTC)
  • I used the talk page to discuss the issue and I was ignored by the other part, who insists on posting picture of people claiming their race as "pardo" without any source! The other should be blocked for vandalism. Xuxo (talk) 15:10, 20 January 2015 (UTC)

Professional advice given at FXCM[edit]

FXCM is a retail currency broker which recently went all-but-bankrupt likely leaving many punters in the lurch. User:Fxcmfraudbuster is a new editor who has only edited this article (a special purpose account) with the advice in the article to get your money out asap, etc.

I greatly sympathize - but fear it is too late. In any case his edit constitutes professional advice, and I have reverted it 2X (going on 3!). Please have an admin revert me if I'm wrong, temporarily lock the article, or whatever.

At User talk:Fxcmfraudbuster, I've informed him of all of this, referred to the ToU, and done all I think I can do.

Smallbones(smalltalk) 15:55, 20 January 2015 (UTC)

Looks like they have stopped for now; let me know if the resume and I will block the editor. OhNoitsJamie Talk 17:41, 20 January 2015 (UTC)
Based on today's news, i updated the article again. It might be more to User:Fxcmfraudbuster's liking, but I doubt that there's anything that will help him much. It's difficult to say anything about these "all-but-bankrupt" cases, but the Citigroup analysts now quoted by Bloomberg have essentially said it all for us. Surprisingly, FXCM's website is still open and they seem to still be accepting new customers. So the firm is not officially bankrupt - the term of art is that it is "an informal bankruptcy." Feel free to revert me, but I'm guessing I know the subtleties here pretty well. Smallbones(smalltalk) 18:50, 20 January 2015 (UTC)

GLPeterson still disruptively pushing his own original research[edit]

GLPeterson (talk · contribs) ANI here ANI/3RRArchive with block here is still following the same behavior noted in those reports of pushing his own original research (consisting of reworked material from two websites he owns) at Wireless power without any edit summary explaining his edits and zero participation on the article talk page, despite numerous requests that he explain his edits and stop replacing sourced material with what seems to be his own opinion diff.

Diffs of GLPeterson's disruptive editing on Wireless power since getting blocked on December 14, 2014. Not all of these are reverts, some are unsourced additions

  • 16:55, January 18, 2015 Another complete rewrite adding new section "Terrestrial transmission line" for his unsourced surface wave material and reinserting disturbed ground and air method into Tesla section, Hertz transmitting wireless power, many other errors
  • 20:07, January 15, 2015 Reinsertion of unsourced claim that Hertz's 1888 transmission of radio waves "experimentally confirmed Maxwell's prediction of wireless energy transfer".
  • 05:42, January 15, 2015 Revert or rewrite of Gil Dawsons correction of his errors in "Capacitive coupling" section.
  • 18:15, January 8, 2015 Reinserted same old Tesla stuff, only non-Tesla source is Corum.
  • 21:59, January 7, 2015 Restored unsourced rewrite after revert by Fountains
  • 09:56, January 7, 2015 Complete rewrite of article, adding new "Bound-mode EM surface wave" section for the unsourced surface wave material from his old "Electrical conduction" section, and inserting same old "Disturbed charge of ground and air" material into Tesla section, unsourced dB figures in table, many other bad edits.
  • 10:50, January 6, 2015‎ Reinserted unsourced dB figures after revert
  • 09:25, January 6, 2015‎ Replaced sourced material in table with cryptic unsourced dB figures
  • 07:31, January 6, 2015 Unsourced WP:SYNTH addition that Hertz's 1888 transmission of radio waves "experimentally confirmed Maxwell's prediction of wireless energy transfer". No one calls Hertz's reception of microwatt signals "wireless energy transfer"

We are near the bottom of the WP:DDE flow chart with this editor. What was true at this ANI is still true, this editor does not communicate. The tactic he has been following for the last 8 years of adding material he seems to think has to be added to Wikipedia, via rewriting the articles Wireless energy transfer, Wireless energy transmission, Wireless power, and creating the article World Wireless System now includes inventing subsection topic names for it re: "Bound-mode electromagnetic surface wave", "Terrestrial transmission line technique". GLPeterson's has added a new tactic of maintaining his own copy of the article Wireless power at User:GLPeterson/Revised Draft which he keeps copying/pasting wholesale into Wireless power. This all seems to show a desire to PUSH his own WP:OR, WP:SYNTH, and non-standard terminology instead of showing a good-faith desire to improve content. Fountains of Bryn Mawr (talk) 23:01, 19 January 2015 (UTC)

I would like to hear from GLPeterson, but having worked some on the World Wireless System article and having just read this talk page thread, I'm convinced that it's time to consider a topic ban. His obtuse communication style and repeated insertion of original research into various articles is indeed disruptive. - MrX 03:30, 20 January 2015 (UTC)
I entirely agree with both the above editors. For years ([34], [35], [36]) GLPeterson has WP:OWNed the Wireless power article, tenaciously WP:PUSHing his unsourced WP:OR, WP:FRINGE theories about wireless power transmission based on 110 year old ideas from Nikola Tesla, and reverting efforts to correct it. Although he does cite sources, the sources are not reliable; mainly primary sources consisting of Tesla's erroneous 19th century writings or modern pseudoscientific authors. He is the only editor supporting this material, against the consensus of at least 5 editors: Chetvorno, Fountains of Bryn Mawr, Wtshymanski, Roches, MrX and occasionally GliderMaven ([37]). He pushes the same material on World Wireless System (which he created as a WP:POVFORK for his material), Wardenclyffe tower, and several other articles, as detailed in an earlier ANI. There is also a Fringe Theories Noticeboard complaint about his material. In general he seldom gives edit comments or discusses his edits on the Talk page unless he is facing administrative sanctions. Gary Peterson (GLPeterson) appears to own several websites [38], [39] and a bookstore [40] specializing in Tesla information which he uses as sources in articles, and seems to fit the profile of a WP:SPA, virtually his only activity is inserting his dubious WP:OR Tesla theories into a variety of articles. Although I would like to hear his side, I think eventually a topic ban may be needed, as in his long term behavior this editor has shown little respect or even understanding [41], [42] of Wikipedia collaboration, consensus, or verifiability policies.--ChetvornoTALK 12:40, 20 January 2015 (UTC)

History of edit-warring on Wireless power Here is a list of GLPeterson's reverts prior to being blocked 13 December 2014 (his reverts after the block are given in User:Fountains of Bryn Mawr's list above):

The disputed material was originally a section called "Electrical conduction", and some material in "Timeline of wireless power". Beginning September 2014, Fountains of Bryn Mawr and I with help from Wtshymanski rewrote this into a properly sourced "History" section. GLPeterson continually reverted our edits, either with no edit comment or calling them "damage". He is shrewd enough not to technically violate the 3RR, but has twice "run the clock out" by performing his 3rd revert just after 24 hrs has elapsed (diffdiffdiffdiff) and (diff, 18:59 Dec 11 is followed by four reverts, the last at diff, 19:05 Dec 12).

These problems were thoroughly discussed on the Talk page (Talk:Wireless power#Way too much Tesla, Talk:Wireless power#Timeline of Wireless Power, 2008 Entry No. 3, Talk:Wireless power#Electrical Conduction) and GLPeterson was invited to participate [43], [44] He did, but he only repeated quotes from his own material [45] and declined to provide reliable sources [46]. Three editors reached out to him on his personal Talk page to try to discuss his edits [47], [48], [49], but he either did not respond or answered with a cryptic quote from Neil Armstrong. I brought a ANI/3RR complaint against him 13 December 2014 and he received a 48hr block. Although his discussions with the administrator on his Talk page were polite (User_talk:GLPeterson#Request_for_assistance), he mentioned legal action [50] and did not indicate any understanding of WP consensus or an intention to drop the issue [51].

Since the block he has resumed the same disruptive editing. He vandalized the article Talk page [52], [53] inserting his comments and unsourced material in boldface between other editors comments. He then resumed reinserting his same unsourced material in the article, along with new dubious material as detailed by the diff list in Fountains of Bryn Mawr's complaint at top. In two wholesale rewrites he has added sections called "Terrestrial transmission line" 16:55, January 18, 2015 and "Bound-mode EM surface wave" 09:56, January 7, 2015 containing expanded versions of his unsourced "surface wave" content from his old section, in both edits also reinserting his old unsourced Tesla material into "Tesla's experiments" section along with much other unsourced material. Again these concerns were discussed on the Talk page (Talk:Wireless power#Recent changes to summary table and Talk:Wireless power#Reintroduction of unsourced pseudoscientific content), [54], [55], and GLPeterson was personally invited to respond [56]. I asked him again 7 January 2015 on his personal Talk page to discuss his changes at the article Talk page, with no response [57].

As mentioned by Fountains of Bryn Mawr above, he maintains a complete alternate Wireless power article User:GLPeterson/Revised Draft diff in his personal pages, containing his unsourced WP:FRINGE material, indicating an intention to continue his edit-warring (having seen this ANI, he is apparently trying to hide his page [[58]] by erasing it and leaving a link to a previous version). Over the years this single editor's obstructive actions have wasted, and continue to waste, huge amounts of other editor's time and effort.--ChetvornoTALK 12:40, 20 January 2015 (UTC)

I agree with the above. The editor in question is polite, when he does comment on talk pages, but persists in re-adding the Tesla material. The Wireless power article has been improved by Chetvorno and others recently. It does not fail to mention Tesla; it just mentions his work in the correct perspective and in appropriate historical context. The addition of more Tesla material would be superfluous, and would unbalance the article, even if it were clearly written. The problem with the edit-warring is that the content uses non-standard and often obsolete scientific jargon. Initially, I thought that, if the editor was willing to update the terminology and explain things from a clear and modern perspective, the content might have a place on Wikipedia. I'm not sure if that will be possible. Roches (talk) 20:41, 20 January 2015 (UTC)

Editor deliberately adding BLP violation (and unsourced claims) back to article[edit]

I THINK WE'RE DONE HERE
Four days into this thread, no administrator has seen fit to take any action and further discussion seems unlikely to be productive. Beeblebrox (talk) 21:28, 20 January 2015 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Scalhotrod, with whom I am often in conflict, has repeatedly added an obvious BLP violation back to the Juelz Ventura article after I removed it. The content in question identifies a notable professional basketball player as a porn actor who has "performed" with Ventura. The claim is all but certainly false, and the cited reference provides absolutely no support for the claim. I initially removed the violation here [59]; Scalhotrod restored it (and other claims without any RS) here [60] and here [61] and here [62], with inappropriate, bordering on insulting, edit summaries. (The supposed supporting reference is a promotional page for Penthouse, and is, at best, a primary source that does not reliably identify any individual beyond Ventura, and really is just advertising for a paid-membership website.) The disputed content, rather promotional, is so slipshod that it identifies a male performer as an "actress", and was initially added by . . . Scalhotrod. Scalhotrod refuses to engage in reasonable discussion on porn-related issues -- note, for example, this personal attack in an edit summary [63] restoring demonstrably false claims to another porn bio -- and has just come off a lengthy topic ban for for similarly inappropriate behavior in another area. Some sanction regarding BLP editing is in order. The Big Bad Wolfowitz (aka Hullaballoo) (talk) 16:33, 16 January 2015 (UTC)

It appears that "TJ Cummings" is indeed a pornographic actor, however, is not the same TJ Cummings in our article of the same. In other words, there are two different people named TJ Cummings, one who is a pornographic actor and appears to be white, and the other who is a basketball player and appears to be black. I assume, in the case of the former, the surname "Cummings" is a novelty stage name. While giving Scalhotrod the benefit of the doubt that he was confused by the identical names, I agree with The Big Bad Wolfowitz that the wikilink should be removed. BlueSalix (talk) 17:24, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
The problem appears to have rectified itself. I removed the wikilinks to TJ Cummings, after which Scalhotrod deleted the name altogether and replaced it with some other porn actor. BlueSalix (talk) 17:47, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
The Talk page for Talk:Juelz Ventura is surprisingly absent of HW's efforts to communicate[64]. But if this is just about a Wikilink that's pointed at the wrong place, holy crap HW, why couldn't you just say that and leave out all the puffery and hyperbole? I've gone ahead and removed the link and added 2 other working links that point to the correct actors[65]. I have also started a discussion on the Talk page if you have other concerns that you would like to specifically articulate, rather than bury things an Edit summary when you are blanking a section or sections of an article[66].
For anyone else, this is just a content dispute, these are not the droids you are looking for. "Move along (click) Move along" please... :) (end of Star Wars reference) Regards, --Scalhotrod (Talk) ☮ღ☺ 17:54, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
No, Chris, this is not simply a content dispute. This is principally about your irresponsible, at best careless, at worst dishonest, approach to editing BLPs. It's evident you never bothered to check the accuracy of the pages you link to. Itcouldn't be more obvious from the "correction" you just made to the Juelz Ventura page, where you got one of the two links wrong. Only a week or so ago you accused me of BLP zealotry after I [error removed] deleted unsourced claims that an identified living person was involved in the making of human-animal porn, a position no reasonable, honest editor would make. You went out of your way to add the BLP violation back to the Ventura article, and you never checked the article you were intent on adding a link to. Just like you never checked to begin with. Instead, you used snarky, derisive, disruptive edit summaries to divert attention from your misbehaviour. Your carelessness isn't limited to porn BLPs, although that's where your most flagrant misbehaviour occurs. Just a dayor so ago, at Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, you rejected an edit as unsourced even though it clearly wasn't -- and you pretty much admitted on my talk page you did so because you hadn't even bothered to check the relevant source. And, as usual, you wouldn't admit your error, you just posted snarky and derisive comments on my talk page, where you've long been unwelcome. You've mad it clear that you don't accept BLP policy calling for dubious content to be removed immediately, without waiting for discussion. You plainly don't accept policy and guideline limits on promotional content (which isn't surprising given the amount of COI editing you've done, or the fact that you've dropped your own name into articles.) But that disagreement doesn't allow you to restore BLP violations, which you have done repeatedly. The Big Bad Wolfowitz (aka Hullaballoo) (talk) 18:45, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
Wow. That sounds like exactly how Scalhotrod is behaving with a BLP conflict with me. I sympathize with you User:Hullaballoo Wolfowitz. I am having my own difficulties with Scalhotrods "irresponsible, at best careless, at worst dishonest, approach to editing BLPs." [67][68][69][70][71]
..."narky and derisive comments". Yep, that about sums it up.🐍 19:43, 16 January 2015 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Shark310 (talkcontribs)
Shark310, you forgot an important one... [72] and please learn to sign your comments, you're going to blowout the SineBot. --Scalhotrod (Talk) ☮ღ☺ 19:54, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
yet another snarky and rude comment. No, I didnt forget it, I thought I'd let you bring it up. Because you seem to think that the result of an SPI allows you to violate BLP policy and consensus multiple times. When all else fails, bring up socking. scalhotrod seems to believe the best defense for violating policy is to attack. It really is a shame. I'm sorry Hullaballoo Wolfowitz, it sucks you have to deal with this ridiculousness. I'm having my own trouble with scalhotrod and his blatant disregard for BLP policy.Shark310(talk)🐍 20:04, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
This is a "Snarky" comment... Anyone need a popcorn refill? I'm off to run errands... --Scalhotrod (Talk) ☮ღ☺ 20:10, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
It sounds like there are some long-term issues here. But this ANI only addresses an immediate issue of a wikilink that has been completely and totally solved. If there's some other issue it should be saved and brought-up in a separate ANI and this one let die. BlueSalix (talk) 20:35, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
Animal porn, huh? What the heck are you talking about? --Scalhotrod (Talk) ☮ღ☺ 19:14, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
On January 4, in a discussion of Squeakbox, you referred to my reversing edits you made with edit summaries (plural) referring to BLP. In the group of edits you referred to, there were only two with summaries referencing BLP. Since you took credit for the content I removed, I inferred you were responsible for it. If you now would say you were not, I'll accept that unless it's shown otherwise, although I don't understand why you would take creditfor it to begin with. The content at issue was in Pornography in Europe, and given the nature of it I'm not going to link to it directly. When I raised the same point in the January 4 discussion, in responseto your rather gratuitous and inaccurate comments about me, you didn't claim any inaccuracy. The Big Bad Wolfowitz (aka Hullaballoo) (talk) 19:47, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
You'll have to be more specific with your allegation, cause I'm just not seeing it. The only edit I made to Pornography in Europe was this[73] on January 1 which involved Wikilinks to several other articles for directors. What does that have to do with animal porn? --Scalhotrod (Talk) ☮ღ☺ 19:59, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
  • I'm going to go out on a limb and say that we're done here. Nothing worse than a mistake is proven, if that--then again, Scalhotrod, these are BLPs and the stuff should be taken seriously. Linking from porn to a non-porn person is a serious error, and can cause some real-world grief. I'm quite serious--this is not some baconated joke. The last charge, I can't quite follow it, and it seems like Hullabaloo is not pursuing it, at least not here.

    Anywayz, I was going to close this and say something like "ANI is for incidents, patterns of behavior are better addressed via a Wikipedia:Requests for comment/User conduct"--but that venue is "deprecated", which I think is a euphemism for "disappeared". In other words, User:Hullaballoo Wolfowitz, you are encouraged, if you indeed think there is a pattern here, to seek other means of dispute resolution: WP:CONDUCTDISPUTE. Drmies (talk) 00:39, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

  • Oh, one more thing, Scalhotrod--the kids are watching a movie in the other room so I checked on this reference of yours--I strongly encourage everyone to NOT use that kind of sourcing. I scratched it and it doesn't even smell reliable. Drmies (talk) 00:41, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
  • Fair point, I guess its WP:PRIMARY since its a directory of the pictorials for that person in that particular publication and its website. For the record, I was interested in the text as the source. My apologies for the mis-link in a BLP article to another BLP. I wasn't the one that originally added it, as I usually check links before hitting Save. But I'll be more diligent with my link checking. --Scalhotrod (Talk) ☮ღ☺ 01:39, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
I stand corrected, I did indeed add that link and not check it properly. My apologies for the error. I'm not much of a sports person, so it never occurred to me that it might be someone else. Thanks for keeping me honest Wolfie... :) --Scalhotrod (Talk) ☮ღ☺ 23:18, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
It has nothing to do with being "much of a sportsperson". You've repeatedly trivialized BLP enforcement, particularly with regard to porn, and even when you "corrected" the Juelz Ventura article after the issue was made clear here you made exactly the same mistake by not checking the links -- fortunately this time linking to the "Eric Masterson" DAB page rather than another BLP, but that was purely by chance. The Big Bad Wolfowitz (aka Hullaballoo) (talk) 02:40, 19 January 2015 (UTC)
And instead of dropping the WP:STICK since you have removed the section in question from the article[75], you keep moaning about it along with removing other content you WP:IDONTLIKEIT [76]. Although I find it interesting that you deleted the content mentioning that Ventura is a parent using the edit summary "spamref"[77] that cites an interview. And since the point you seem to be trying to make is about long term editing habits, that last edit is one example of how you like to remove content from adult film performer BLP articles that adds a human interest aspect to them. You're welcome to personally have as much disdain as you want for anyone, but you shouldn't be editing their articles while holding out that you're some kind of bastion of BLP integrity. --Scalhotrod (Talk) ☮ღ☺ 19:06, 19 January 2015 (UTC)
Found another one from today, same thing[78] for Nici Sterling. You deleted content about her being married, to whom, being a parent, and her sexual orientation. If you have a problem with the sources, so be it. But that is what RSN is for, not running to ANI. Have you been deleting this stuff for so long that its just a reflex and you do not consider the consequences? You've pointed me at a link that goes back over 4 years. --Scalhotrod (Talk) ☮ღ☺ 20:11, 19 January 2015 (UTC)
Bullshit, Chris, utter bullshit. The first removal you object to was a link to pornfidelity.com, a porn vendor site that is not used as a reference in any other article, and which has been removed as unreliable even by editors who routinely dispute my position on porn. The second removal you object to is a referenced to a self-published Weebly site, not the article subject's official site, which simply can't be used in a BLP. You can cast all the AGF-violating aspersions you want to, but all you're doing is placing your own good faith and/or competence under a pretty dark cloud. The Big Bad Wolfowitz (aka Hullaballoo) (talk) 21:15, 19 January 2015 (UTC)
HW, I'm not claiming that ANY of those sources were stellar, but you appointed yourself "judge, jury, and executioner" of the source and the content associated with it. We're talking about simple things like being married or being a parent, not your typical "controversial, muck-raking" content that floods many mainstream celebrity or politician articles. You could simply remove the source and place a [citation needed] tag, but you don't, you delete and find something else to blank. Adding your crypticly short Edit summaries to the mix just makes the situation sad IMO. --Scalhotrod (Talk) ☮ღ☺ 22:03, 19 January 2015 (UTC)
You're just making stuff up now. There's no exception in BLP for "simple things". There's no exception in BLP for unsourced warm fuzzy claims. BLP is simply about getting things right, and demonstrating that Wikipedia gets things right. As Jimbo has said, and I paraphrase, saying nothing is better than saying something we can't be confident is accurate. And, Chris, your habits as a pending changes reviewer show that you don't practice what you're claiming to preach here. We all can see that you want relaxed BLP standards for porn. No reasonable editor agrees with you aboutcarving out such an exception. Harassing and haranguing editors enforcing simple, uncontroversial policy standards is disruptive misbehavior, and you're only days removed from a lengthy topic ban for similar misbehavior on another subject. The Big Bad Wolfowitz (aka Hullaballoo) (talk) 03:17, 20 January 2015 (UTC)
HW, I realize that you're trying so very hard to say things and make threats to attempt to "rattle my cage" or upset me in some way. It's obvious that you're diligent Editor, but you're doing little to convince me (and many others reading this judging by the comments I recent off wiki) that you're capable of seeing a situation in any way other than your own. Time for another Popcorn break... --Scalhotrod (Talk) ☮ღ☺ 20:25, 20 January 2015 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Meatpuppetry case going after Featured Article writer Neelix[edit]

  1. There's a serious case of Meatpuppetry going after Featured Article writer, editor Neelix, and unfortunately they've successfully driven him off Wikipedia entirely.
  2. Sockpuppetry investigation case at Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Cactusjackbangbang didn't show technical relations, and admin HJ Mitchell recommended DIFF that I bring this case here to ANI for something concrete to be done about this meatpuppetry.
  3. An IP user commented at the SPI case page, in support and acknowledgement that it is meatpuppetry: "Hi guys there actually was like 12 different people doing these edits, not one person lol.......".
  4. Admins, please, I implore you to do something about this meatpuppetry that has driven a valued Featured Article writer off this website.

Thank you,

Cirt (talk) 17:23, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

I'm honestly at a loss as to what the best thing to do is, which is why I suggested to Cirt that he bring it here for more eyes. This is the list from the SPI:
They're technically  Unrelated according to CU data, so I wonder if anyone knows where they've come from... HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 18:21, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
Check the contributions of each. If you see evidence of harassment in light of the contributions of the others, then block. It is easy enough to evade checkuser if you know how the Internet address system works, and if there is a group working together to harass somebody, the sanction is the same as if it were one editor. I've blocked a few but decided not to block Johnnydowns. We should probably warn him, and then see what he does. Jehochman Talk 19:02, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
I'm not an expert by any means, but I know enough to know that it's not that difficult to obfuscate your identity to the extend that a CU won't reveal anything useful, but the IPs are bouncing all over the place—various US cities, Toronto, London ... and they all look like home broadband ISPs. I suspect this is being coordinated from somewhere else on the Internet. I've blocked all the remaining accounts bar Jdh9 (I hadn't seen your comment wrt Jonnydowns when I did so). The pattern is clear: brand-new or long-dormant accounts have come out of nowhere, created a one-line userpage, and then immediately proceeded to remove chunks of content/participate in AfDs or otherwise cause disruption to articles, all of which were written by the same person. Call me a cynic, but that's too much of a coincidence for me. Jdh9 appears to have other interests and their response to Cirt on their talk page seems to suggest that they're as confused as we are, so I'm inclined to AGF. None of the IPs have edited recently (except the one I blocked yesterday) so I'm not going to block them. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 19:35, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
FWIW, I think that there might be some legitimate concerns regarding how to apply notability specifically in terms of theatrical performances, and have started discussion at Wikipedia talk:Notability (events)#Notability of theatrical performances?. John Carter (talk) 22:22, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
I've been in contact with Neelix and he thinks that, at least in the short term, his retirement may be somewhat permanent. He also indicated to me a few pages which he might like to see developed, which I have indicated on his user talk page. Any help in improving any of them in his honor would be greatly appreciated. The one he thought might be most appropriate would be Homestead (Star Trek: Voyager), the episode in which Neelix left the series, and I think I may have found a few reliable sources which could be used, as I've indicated on the article talk page. Anyone familiar with developing articles on such topics is more than welcome to do so. John Carter (talk) 21:49, 20 January 2015 (UTC)

Johnnydowns and blocked user Vegetablelasagna1[edit]

  1. Johnnydowns (talk · contribs) did not edit Wikipedia for three (3) years DIFF DIFF
  2. Among first edits back in three (3) years is to create one-line-long-userpage DIFF.
  3. First edit back in three (3) years is about "vegetable lasagna" at article Sci-Fi Dine-In Theater Restaurant DIFF.
  4. Compare that edit to blocked account Vegetablelasagna1.
  5. Johnnydowns (talk · contribs) has also commented at two (2) AFDs related to Neelix DIFF, DIFF.

Cirt (talk) 18:58, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

Yeah, somebody should double check, and if they agree, warn him. Jehochman Talk 19:02, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
Jehochman do you think comparing DIFF with account username Vegetablelasagna1 (talk · contribs) is a pretty obvious connection of meatpuppetry? — Cirt (talk) 19:06, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
feel free to run a CheckUser. John Bailey Owen (talk) 19:05, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
This above comment by Johnnydowns (talk · contribs) seems like baiting and evidence supporting comment by Jehochman above that the meatpuppets know how to game the Checkuser system. — Cirt (talk) 19:07, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
(edit conflict)That would be pointless. We already know that these are either different people, or one person with enough brains not to reuse the same IP address. Jehochman Talk 19:09, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
also, look at the text of my comments on those AFDs - I've been accused of sock puppetry from the moment I started editing. John Bailey Owen (talk) 19:07, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
If you want editors to look at something, please provide diffs. For the moment, please just leave Neelix alone. Don't do anything to stress them out and you can go edit in peace. How's that? Jehochman Talk 19:09, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
Absurd. Johnnydowns edits were actual edits, reverted by Neelix [79] with a false accusation of vandalism. Vegetablelasagna1 is one edit throwaway account that failed to CU to Johnnydowns. Neelix also had serious ownership issues with this WP:INVOLVED full protection of "their" article. (Quickly reverted by another admin, fortunately). Given they're retired, no need to pursue that further. "Featured Article" writers as just as "valued" as any other editor, and they are not entitled to special "ownership" rights to content they agreed can be edited, used, and redistributed—by anyone NE Ent 19:24, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
  • Not sure I see the point of this; it's already been run through SPI, and deletion discussions and everything else. The community's already decided what to do with these articles, more or less. I don't understand why it's necessary that someone, anyone, be punished because an experienced editor's work was seriously criticized. Risker (talk) 19:46, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
  • It's good to see at least some questioning of this lunacy from Risker and NE Ent. The "harassment" supposedly perpetrated against Neelix seems to be mostly that people edited and condensed articles that Neelix seems to think he owned. The real problem is that Neelix reverted good faith edits without explanation, then tried to protect "his" pages and block users who made edits he didn't like. Then he got called on it and retired. Now the users who edited the Neelix-owned pages are being blocked and run through multiple investigations. At this point it looks like Cirt is hounding people because they made edits to the pages of someone s/he's friendly with. There's no conspiracy here - multiple people just thought Neelix's owned articles needed some work. And now that the changes have been reverted, those pages still need some work, but now it seems to be impossible to do it.Wobzrem (talk) 19:59, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
    • Ludicrous. What about "vegetable lasagna" compared with DIFF made by an account that chose to name itself by username vegetablelasagna1 ? — Cirt (talk) 20:08, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
      • So just so we all have this straight, you're trying to get an editor banned (and have seemingly succeeded) because he made a minor spelling change, and one of the phrases he edited (among many legitimate edits) was also the name of what seems to be a oneoff joke account? I guess you can spell the word either "lasagna" or "lasagne" and be more or less correct, but changing it from one to the other certainly isn't a malicious edit or hounding.Wobzrem (talk) 20:24, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
        • "vegetable lasagna" shows the account has an interest in the subject matter, and compared with DIFF made by an account that chose to name itself by username vegetablelasagna1 it shows a stark commonality between the two accounts. — Cirt (talk) 22:21, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
  • Hello. I am one of the people who keeps being accused of being involved in this. I have been attempting to largely stay out of it because it doesn't concern me, but basically every time I log in I'm getting notifications that Cirt keeps tagging me in these investigations. I've basically given this summary 5 times now but here's what has happened from my side: I'm a polisci grad student who joined Wikipedia because I noticed that a lot of articles about notable political scientists are stubs that could use more info for students who are using Wiki as a first stop in writing research papers. I also got curious about how the admin/editing side worked, and started reading some AfD and wanted to participate in some to see how it works. I picked what I thought were relatively simple, noncontroversial articles so I wouldn't be stepping on too many toes while learning, and ironically I ended up posting on two that happened to be part of a massive shitstorm, but did not edit or touch the articles in question outside of participating in those discussions (as I was under the assumption this is not allowed...I am still unclear of whether or not I am correct in this). I become mentioned in a sockpuppet investigation, during which I explain this and ask if anyone can clarify what exactly I am being included in, and am given no answers whatsoever, despite clarifying that I am new. I assume it will take care of itself and return to editing, doing a few touchups on pop-culture related pages to practice editing before moving into stuff that requires more sourcing and work. One of these was the page for the comedy podcast Comedy Bang Bang, and which Cirt then flags because one of the sockpuppets has "bangbang" in their name. I explain, and am again ignored. Finally, I decide to just stop posting on any of this at all and start working on some of the stuff I had registered to do, and then I get flagged in this after already being cleared once and intentionally staying away from this whole situation because clearly I had no idea what was going on. I agree something fishy is happening, but I am in a "wrong place/wrong time" situation and am getting slightly sick of being steamrolled by Cirt every other day when I am largely minding my own business and only jumping in to defend myself. With all due respect, if you're worried about people being driven away from Wikipedia, assuming anyone new who steps up to participate is a troll and steamrolling them is just as big of a problem as whatever the hell was going on with the senior editor who left. I have gotten incredibly hesitant to even work on the kinds of pages I had intended to because I am worried I will be flagged or blocked if I make a mistake or I edit an article that is seemingly related to this whole thing, especially given that, as noted, any reasonable request I have made for explanations has been ignored or responded to with another notification. Not to get on a high horse, but the point of Wikipedia is mass participation from people who care and want to pitch in. This is highly discouraging. I am sorry for the length, but as you can see, I am getting very frustrated and confused.Jdh9 (talk) 21:21, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
  1. Jdh9 (talk · contribs) = creates one-line-long-userpage DIFF.
  2. Finds himself at AFD related to article contributed by Neelix on his fourth (4th) edit, ever DIFF.
  3. On his sixth (6th) edit ever, finds himself at another AFD of article contributed by Neelix, at DIFF.

Cirt (talk) 22:13, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

Is there a way to delete Jdh9 from this whole mess. Looking through his edits he sure seems legit. Don't forget he may have edited as an IP before.