Wikipedia:Education noticeboard

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Welcome to the education noticeboard
Purpose of this page Using this page

This page is for discussion of items that relate to student assignments and the Wikipedia Education Program. Please feel free to post, whether you're from a class, a potential class, or if you're a Wikipedia editor.

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Copy-paste merging versus history-merging[edit]

Followup to the already archived Wikipedia:Education noticeboard/Archive 16#Proposal for update in the student instructions for moving drafts into mainspace. See Wikipedia talk:Merging#When to request a histmerge. You might consider making the archiving of this page a little less aggressive, so I'm not forced to create a fork of a discussion that's less than a month old. – wbm1058 (talk) 15:59, 27 May 2017 (UTC)

@Wbm1058: 7 days is rather aggressive, isn't it. I think that's a hold-over from when course announcements were all posted here rather than a subpage, making the page fairly unwieldy when not archived frequently. I've changed it to 30 days -- we'll see how that works. And thanks for the link. I'll take a look at this on Monday, but wanted to comment that this is definitely something we want to spend time on this summer, revising training materials prior to the fall 2017 courses starting. I've added DNAU to this thread to ensure it's here at that time. Also want to ping Shalor (Wiki Ed), the content expert working with that class in particular. --Ryan (Wiki Ed) (talk) 17:29, 27 May 2017 (UTC)

See also Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/688809 Memory/Archive. We need adequate notice of student editing, and course instructors shouldn't be assigning the task of writing multiple content forks of the same topic, leaving it for overworked volunteers to clean up. – wbm1058 (talk) 12:22, 6 June 2017 (UTC)

I apologise for dropping the ball on that one, I started preparing the page about the course but didn't share it on the announcement noticeboard. Advance notice of editing would certainly have helped, but the students' accounts remain blocked. Please could the blocks be lifted? Richard Nevell (WMUK) (talk) 12:29, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
I don't think just an announcement on a noticeboard is sufficient. Most editors are not monitoring these noticeboards. There should be some indication on the editor's user or user talk page, such as Template:Student editor (e.g., like this). It should link to their assignment, so we can see what their objective is. wbm1058 (talk) 12:48, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
Note how Wikipedia:Wiki Ed/Rutgers University/Languages in Peril Section II (Spring 2017) lists each student in the class, along with the titles of the Wikipedia articles that they are working on.
Wikipedia:Outreach Dashboard/Swansea University/LAA319 - Competition Law doesn't have a similar list of students and articles. – wbm1058 (talk) 12:53, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
OK, I see that course runs until 28 June 2017. Can these closely related articles either be merged, or clearly differentiated using WP:summary style so that it's clear they are not forks covering the same topic? wbm1058 (talk) 13:18, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
Just to comment on noticeboard announcements, though wbm1058 has since clarified that's not necessarily the question here, I don't think there's a formal process for announcing Education Program classes in general. Wikipedia:Education noticeboard/Wiki Ed course submissions is a page of notices automatically (or semi-automatically) generated by the Wiki Ed Dashboard), but I don't think WMF has incorporated an equivalent into the Programs and Events Dashboard (classes outside the US/CA), so the best way to stay up on that would probably be to keep tabs on the Dashboard itself. --Ryan (Wiki Ed) (talk) 12:51, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
Btw, Wbm1058, I don't know if you saw this, but from the page you linked you can click the "Dashboard" link at the top and then go to the "students" tab to see the list of students and assigned articles (though it looks like most have not added an article yet -- perhaps that's what you mean). --Ryan (Wiki Ed) (talk) 13:32, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
Thanks, no I didn't find that until you pointed it out. But there I see "Assignment End: 2017-05-10", so it's not clear to me whether the course is still active, and whether the students will return to editing if their accounts are unlocked. Sockpuppet investigations isn't an area I'm active in administratively, so I'm unclear on proper procedures for reopening an investigation and unblocking editors... if we can wait on User:Bbb23 to do it then I'm sure it will be done the right way. – wbm1058 (talk) 13:43, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
  • I'll keep an eye on students doing this. This summer we're going to be working on refining some of our handouts and instructions, so this will definitely be something we look at. :) Shalor (Wiki Ed) (talk) 12:55, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
  • Frankly, folks, Wiki Ed drives me crazy. You have no idea how many cases are brought to WP:SPI from which, understandably, blocks ensue and then along comes someone to say, oh, these are students. How are we supposed to know that? There should be a clear notice on their userpage as to who they are and a link to the program. It would be better for you, the students, and the various unsuspecting editors at Wikipedia who become involved. I'm not going to spontaneously look at a Wiki Ed venue every time I evaluate a case. Unless you start cleaning up your procedures, this won't be the last time this happens. I will unblock the four accounts and remove the sock tags from their userpages (no need to reopen the case). Someone else can deal with the undeleting of any pages that were deleted. BTW, Richard, you should not have edited the SPI archive. Instead, you should have gone to Wbm1058, to me, or to an SPI clerk to make your request. I'm sure Wiki Ed is a lot of work and you, of course, provide a valuable service to Wikipedia and to the outside community, so I apologize for being, uh, brusque.--Bbb23 (talk) 14:22, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
  • @Bbb23: Every class working with Wiki Ed (the Wiki Education Foundation) should have a list of students on the course page, a tag on every student's user page, and a tag on the articles they work on (there are some exceptions to the latter based on the way sandboxes are handled). I think that you're probably talking about the parts of the Education Program that aren't Wiki Ed? That seems like it could be addressed by incorporating the templating procedures into the P&E Dashboard. @Sage (Wiki Ed): who is the best person to ask about that at WMF (or otherwise)? --Ryan (Wiki Ed) (talk) 14:41, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
  • If the P&E Dashboard was set up to automatically create a page on-wiki listing editors involved that would be very helpful. Currently it has to be manually set up which relies on my (very much fallible) memory. Richard Nevell (WMUK) (talk) 15:41, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
  • @Ryan (Wiki Ed): Are you saying that this program with these users was not part of Wiki Ed?--Bbb23 (talk) 14:45, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
  • Ah, I'll try to remember that. And here I thought the only Foundation I had to bitch about was the WMF. A new target for my irritation.--Bbb23 (talk) 14:59, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
  • I see that m:Education is a disambiguation page. It would be nice, and less confusing for unaffiliated, independent editors and administrators, if the Wikipedia Education Program, a program of Wikimedia Outreach (why is that page tagged as "historical" if the Education Program still uses their logo and Outreach has its own wiki?), had all of their chapters, including WMUK, using the same standards and procedures developed by the Wiki Education Foundation, which I presume is no longer a proposed Wikimedia thematic organization, as the disambiguation page still claims? wbm1058 (talk) 15:45, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
@Bbb23: WikiEd haven't done anything wrong here (and do an excellent job) this course is under my auspices rather than theirs. I agree that student accounts should include a note on their user page that they are taking part in an educational course and I will make sure that happens. Thank you for taking the time to unblock the accounts. I apologise for the extra work this has created and appreciate that it is taking up your volunteer time. Richard Nevell (WMUK) (talk) 15:39, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
@Richard Nevell (WMUK): Not to worry, many of my comments are tongue-in-cheek, although I have had some negative experiences in the past. This is the first time I've learned something useful, i.e., the division of responsibility. Happy teaching.--Bbb23 (talk) 15:44, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
@Bbb23: Yes, there are different hubs of activity. For future courses (not just this one but others I'm involved) I'll be making sure students have a notice on their user page and on talk pages as Ryan said is compulsory for WikiEd courses. Currently I recommend it for courses WMUK assists, but it should be a requirement rather than a recommendation. Please could 826540MAH (talk · contribs) 838181CDC (talk · contribs) 838463swanseauni (talk · contribs) Elinahh (talk · contribs) Nfyfe826276 (talk · contribs) also be unblocked? Richard Nevell (WMUK) (talk) 16:00, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
 Done.--Bbb23 (talk) 16:37, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
An important responsibility for any class assignment, no matter which program advises it, is to put Template:Educational assignment on the talk page of every article being worked on. That's the first and foremost way to let other editors know that these are student editors, and not something else. Then, as also mentioned above, students should put Template:Student editor on their own userpages – and of course there should be a course page that clearly identifies the instructor. These steps can go a long way towards preventing such problems as mistaking student edits for socking, and also help a lot with keeping communication open with other editors. I think that all programs that work with student assignments should try to make these things clear to all classes they work with. --Tryptofish (talk) 23:27, 6 June 2017 (UTC)

Automatic edits from Programs & Events Dashboard[edit]

@Richard Nevell (WMUK), Wbm1058, Bbb23, and Ryan (Wiki Ed): I'm currently mentoring User:Medhabansal for an internship project to enable edits from Programs & Events Dashboard, which would let us enable some of the edits that the Wiki Ed Dashboard makes on a wiki-by-wiki basis. The project just started, but hopefully within the next few months we can have the automatically-updated course pages and the userpage templates like for Wiki Ed courses. --Sage (Wiki Ed) (talk) 16:58, 6 June 2017 (UTC)

That's a very encouraging development. Richard Nevell (WMUK) (talk) 15:14, 7 June 2017 (UTC)

Online Ambassador application: Abdulrehimras[edit]

This extension was removed, nothing to do here. — xaosflux Talk 16:36, 12 October 2018 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Abdulrehimras[edit]

Abdulrehimras (talk · contribs)

  1. Why do you want to be a Wikipedia Ambassador?
    To have a wider platform and larger knowledge pool to impart academia
  2. In three sentences or less, summarize your involvement with Wikimedia projects.
    YOUR ANSWER (OPTIONAL)
  3. Please indicate a few articles to which you have made significant content contributions. (e.g. DYK, GA, FA, major revisions/expansions/copyedits).
    Revisions
  4. How have you been involved with welcoming and helping new users on Wikipedia?
    Yes
  5. What do you see as the most important ways we could welcome newcomers or help new users become active contributors?
    Guide them through
  6. Have you had major conflicts with other editors? Blocks or bans? Involvement in arbitration? Feel free to offer context, if necessary.
    No
  7. How often do you edit Wikipedia and check in on ongoing discussions? Will you be available regularly for at least two hours per week, in your role as a mentor?
    Yes Am regularly available online
  8. How would you make sure your students were not violating copyright laws?
    Teach them right
  9. If one of your students had an issue with copyright violation how would you resolve it?
    As a legal expert I have many avenues to resolve this
  10. In your _own_ words describe what copyright violation is.
    It is the use of another's creation without permission
  11. What else should we know about you that is relevant to being a Wikipedia Ambassador?
    Am learned, vastly knowledged and intelligent...

Abdulrehimras (talk) 19:15, 18 July 2018 (UTC)

Endorsements[edit]

(Two endorsements are needed for online ambassador approval.)

Not done Thank you for your interest, however we are currently phasing out the MediaWiki extension which uses the Online Ambassador user right - TNT 💖 19:16, 18 July 2018 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

We seem to have a class from the London School of Economics editing Human nature[edit]

Note: A discussion similar to this one is going on at Talk:Sex differences in psychology#LSE project.

See the revision history.[1] I'd say it's being run by User:J.birch2. Cumulatively the edits have made quite a change to the article. User:Andrew Lancaster brought this to my attention. Can anyone please do whatever is normally done with new projects where there's been no obvious contact? Thanks. Doug Weller talk 10:55, 22 January 2019 (UTC)

That's correct. We are in the process of building a section on "Contemporary Philosophy". J.birch2 (talk) 11:08, 22 January 2019 (UTC)
Hi J.birch2, are you in touch with Daria Cybulska (WMUK) or anyone else from Wikimedia UK? See their website for more information on their support available to you. --LiAnna (Wiki Ed) (talk) 15:43, 22 January 2019 (UTC)
I just took a quick look again. It appears that there is quite a bit of original research and some use of sources which may not be the best - I'm not clear why there is such emphasis on certain authors. Not that it was that great an article before. Some other things such as lack of page numbers makes it almost impossible to check the sources. Doug Weller talk 19:49, 23 January 2019 (UTC)
Everyone, including J.birch2, please see Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/M.realini1.--Bbb23 (talk) 18:00, 3 February 2019 (UTC)
I have responded to the "sockpuppet" accusation. Thanks for alerting me. As for the quality of the project so far -- all the editors are beginners and they're learning. We'll improve the sources, page numbers, etc. It's a work in progress. I thank LiAnna (Wiki Ed) for noting WMUK. I have been in touch with them and they helped me set up a dashboard for the project here.J.birch2 (talk) 18:14, 3 February 2019 (UTC)
LiAnna (Wiki Ed), Daria Cybulska (WMUK), Doug Weller and others in this thread: do you have any advice on how my students can avoid having their changes reverted while they are in the middle of working on a page? We've been unable to work on Sex differences in psychology due to quick reverts of all changes. In the short term, I'm redirecting them to a sandbox page in my own userspace. Is this the only way? We're deliberately working on low quality pages in need of improvement, not protected pages or high quality pages.J.birch2 (talk) 13:32, 4 February 2019 (UTC)
My take on the question of reverting is that student editors should be treated the same way as any other editors would be treated. Edit Wikipedia mainspace and you may well be reverted, and the next step should be discussion on the talk page. Therefore, I would strongly oppose any measures that would restrict in any way the ability of editors to revert student edits, partly per WP:OWN. If an instructor chooses to have students edit in mainspace, then dealing with the consequences comes along with the educational experience. Of course, editing in userspace avoids the problem. --Tryptofish (talk) 00:27, 5 February 2019 (UTC)
@J.birch2: Yes, I had some advice on how your students can avoid having their changes reverted while they are in the middle of working on the page. The three approaches are detailed here. I also agree with Tryptofish's comment wholeheartedly, including the last sentence, which matches one of the approaches I recommended at that link.
Being forthcoming and helpful to new editors is a goal here, so any reverts to student edits should be done in a constructive and respectful manner, but as long as the revert is in line with Wikipedia policy and guidelines, then editors should not hesitate to revert an edit by a student that would have been reverted had the editor not been a student. The only difference I would make in so doing, would be to use greater detail than I normally would in the edit summary, adding some relevant policy links to aid in the explanation of the revert, and I might also in some cases add a note on their Talk page as well, if that seemed appropriate. Mathglot (talk) 03:46, 5 February 2019 (UTC)
J.birch2, Jumping in as a previous onlooker. What are your educational goals here? The concept of starting with low quality pages is a good one. However, even if an article is low quality if it is highly watched new edits might scrutinized in a way that existing content is not. Just saying that Human Nature and its 285 watchers will probably attract more scrutiny, and thus require more attention, than say Bioconservatism. This scrutiny, of course, can be good if framed correctly as it's one of the virtues of editing Wikipedia, but also an instructional concept to be ready to instruct around because you cannot control the reaction of other editors. Best wishes, Barkeep49 (talk) 04:40, 5 February 2019 (UTC)
Thanks Barkeep49, Mathglot. J.birch2 (talk) 07:18, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

UCLA course assigning new articles[edit]

This course at UCLA for Jan-Mar 2019 on "Radical Women in Latin American Art" claims 45 students and has two dozen red links in the "Assigned course" column. It's hard enough for intermediate editors to create a brand new article, let alone student editors. Does Wiki Ed admin have an opinion on professors encouraging their students to tackle new articles? Do the teachers, and the students, have sufficent information in their training modules to take on the responsibility? Are they allocated confirmed status manually so that it's even possible? Is this putting a burden on Content experts that they have the bandwith to handle? @Sage (Wiki Ed) and Shalor (Wiki Ed): Mathglot (talk) 07:00, 27 January 2019 (UTC)

  • Hi Mathglot - just wanted to let you know that we haven't forgotten about you! Shalor (Wiki Ed) (talk) 14:05, 30 January 2019 (UTC)
  • Hi Mathglot! Thank you so much for reaching out - as well as all of the other times you’ve helped me out. It means more to me than you know!
It's unsurprising that a course creating biographies of women in Latin American art has a lot of red links; indeed, courses like this are how we think our organization is ideally positioned to help meet our movement strategy of knowledge equity. And while I normally would agree with you that creating new articles is a daunting task for a newbie, one thing our program has found is that biographies, because they're so prescriptively structured, are some of the easiest articles for new editors to create. Obviously notability becomes a huge concern there, but we spend a fair amount of time addressing it with our biographies handout and training materials that students are assigned.
The confirmed bit is actually rather sneaky: If students complete all the exercises assigned in our training modules, then they will make enough minor edits over enough time to have autoconfirmed status and thus are able to move it on their own. If they don't complete the trainings, they won't, and they'll have to ask me or another Wikipedia Expert to move it for them, giving us a chance to assess notability before we move it. I appreciate your concern about our bandwidth, and we calculate that out each term to ensure we're not taking on more courses and more students than we can support. If it helps, only about 10% of the articles our students edit are brand new, so the bulk of our program's work happens to existing articles.
I will definitely keep an eye on this class to make sure that they follow the guidelines for editing, sourcing, and notability. Shalor (Wiki Ed) (talk) 15:35, 31 January 2019 (UTC)
Huge problem we have had as of late is the advice at Wikipedia:Student assignments#Overview not being followed leading to mass disruption and deletion of many new article. Student assignment should be evaluated before publication. To quote "Student assignments should always be carried out using a course page set up by the instructor. It is usually best to develop articles on the students' user pages, or as drafts. After evaluation, the articles may go on to become Wikipedia articles. --Moxy (talk) 20:54, 3 February 2019 (UTC)

Wiki Education's Monthly Report for November 2018 now available[edit]

For those interested in reading about Wiki Education's programmatic activities for the month of November 2018, you can find our report on Commons, on-wiki, or on our blog. Please let me know if you have questions. Cassidy (Wiki Ed) (talk) 21:43, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Courses under Education program ns[edit]

@xaosflux, Can you tell me what happened to courses listed under the old Education_program namespace? See for example, Education Program:University of Canterbury/International Human Rights Law (Semester Two 2017) (now red) which you linked previously at ENB/Archive 16. Was this a temp namespace that is now somewhere else such as under Wikipedia namespace? I see courses older than that one that still have valid pages under the Wikipedia namespace, for example, this one; so what was that other ns about, and where are those pages now? Thanks, Mathglot (talk) 01:28, 4 February 2019 (UTC)

@Mathglot: see phab:T125618 and its subtasks. In short right now you can download a database dump of them, but they are no longer online. They may or may not be coming back within the project namespace see phab:T188407. — xaosflux Talk 01:35, 4 February 2019 (UTC)
Thanks, I subscribed to phab:T188407, the documentation subtask. Mathglot (talk) 01:58, 4 February 2019 (UTC)

Wow, I didn't know this was happening but it is really annoying that seemingly I lost access to data on my past projects, I had list of students, their articles, grading guidelines and other stuff there. I hope this will be restored, if in read-only mode. This is particularly troublesome for less active members. I can imagine some instructors coming back after few years, seeing all of their old work deleted, and deciding figuring out what happened not worth the trouble. PS. If you want to see examples of damage this deletion wrought, see User:Piotrus/Educational_project_results: good thing I saved information about articles my students did... everything else is gone. Also see for example Talk:Rigveda Wiki: "This article is/was the subject of an educational assignment in 2014 Q1. Further details were available on the "Education Program:Hanyang University/Collective Intelligence in Practice (2014)" page, which is now unavailable on the wiki." Nice advertisement - contribute to Wikipedia, your educational project may be obsoleted and deleted. Thank you for helping out. Sigh. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 16:34, 8 February 2019 (UTC)

Wiki Education's Monthly Report for December 2018 now available[edit]

Wiki Education's Monthly Report of programmatic and administrative activities during December 2018 is now available on Commons, on-wiki, and on our blog. Please let me know if you have questions. Cassidy (Wiki Ed) (talk) 18:06, 11 February 2019 (UTC)