Wikipedia:Teahouse/Questions/Archive 899

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Can we as a company create a wikipedia page?


We would like to edit page for our company. We have seen there are several conditions which have to be fulfilled. Who will control these points? We respond to one of them which is enough.

Thank you for your answer.


Pat — Preceding unsigned comment added by Precipart2019 (talkcontribs)

Hi Pat. Welcome to Wikipedia. Goodness, where to start? I'm assuming you represent If so, have a read of this notability guideline on what criteria allows us to include an article on a company. Do you think you meet it? Can you supply three or more references to independent sources (books, magazines, journals, newspapers) which talk about Precipart in detail. If you think you can, go back from your mental list and remove all insider trade journals, blogs, syndicated press releases, company websites and so forth, and consider the question again.Then, because we strongly discourage users from writing about themselves, post only those links to Wikipedia:Requested articles/Business and economics/Companies. Then, if a non-connected editor is motivated to write about your company, they may do so. But do not expect this to be a quick process. If it is deemed to be a genuinely notable company, someone will undoubtedly want to create a page about it. Should you then be motivated to edit that article, resist the temptation. Instead, read and follow our two policies on Paid editing and Declaring a conflict of interest. Follow those guidelines and if you then want to make changes, place an {{edit request}} on the talk page of that article.
A less urgent thing to tell you at this time, which is very easy for you to follow as you have only ever made one edit here, is to cease using the account and create and use another one which only one person (you) can ever use. We don't accept usernames that appear to have more than one editor accessing it, or promoting a company. So "PricipartPat" would be fine - just not the company name on its own, please. I'm sure I've missed something - maybe another host will add further advice. We all work as volunteers to maintain this encyclopaedia. It's important to appreciate we only include 'notable things' in it. It's not for WP:PROMOTION, so you will have to proceed with care. Does this help? Nick Moyes (talk) 15:20, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

Article review on Talk Page

I have been requested to update an article on an Agribusiness company which is quite extensive. I would like to publish my update in comparative form to the existing article on its Talk Page. I have the updated article in my sandbox [1]. What is the best way to publish it on the Talk page? Gibmul (talk) 12:27, 28 January 2019 (UTC)

Creating a new version of an article is rarely a good idea, you are welcome to make suggestions on the talk page, but beware the article is already plagued with conflict of interest paid edits, so I am not going to encourage you. Theroadislong (talk) 14:08, 28 January 2019 (UTC)
What I am trying to achieve is this type of comparitive example for the Talk Page so that editors can decide which edits they would accept Gibmul (talk) 16:15, 28 January 2019 (UTC)
I see that you have properly declared PAID on your User page and the Talk page of the article. My suggestion is to start a new section on the Talk page of the article and for a section of the article, paste in the existing text and your proposed revision. Maybe start with History. Then, up to other editors to implement or not. Repeat. This will be a slow process, as there is not a lot of traffic to the article in question. David notMD (talk) 16:25, 28 January 2019 (UTC)
Thank you for your assistance.Gibmul (talk) 15:43, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

Need mentor for a new user KenGohan

I am just here to ask for a mentor for this user. Apparently he is editing on this article. All I know about him, that he has lack of experience in adding citations or referencing sources. I have left two messages in his talk page regarding this issue. Other editors also informed him but it seems like he doesn't want to or can't understand. This request might have some grammatical issues since English is not my first language. Thanks
Masum Reza(talk) 15:43, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

Edit not saved

Hello. Trying desperately to add an item to the requested articles page: I started getting an error, edit not saved when I tried to include links to Then I tried reference tags but messed the closing tag, and now I can’t even fix that because even if my item has no links, I still get the not saved error, possibly because of the other links in other items of the same section. Halp! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Authorlahey (talkcontribs) 16:10, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

I have corrected your referencing error. As the error message said, the closing tag should be </ref>; you had <\ref>, which isn't the same. I don't understand what you mean by the "not saved error"; at what stage are you seeing that? --David Biddulph (talk) 16:18, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

Preventing vandalism.

Hi. In the ideal world, Wikipedia would be vandalism-free from when it started until the end of time. However, I'm pretty sure there's lots of vandalism in reality despite the best efforts of users and bots, all of which was probably committed by at least 100s if not 1000s of users. Why not create more bots to fight it (duplicating existing ones or ones made from scratch) or even being able to create an account that is meant just for this purpose? (talk) 07:35, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

It is sometimes difficult for humans to distinguish vandalism from genuine edits, so bots certainly cannot operate with 100% accuracy, despite advances in artificial intelligence. The existing anti-vandalism bots (such as User:ClueBot NG) are often quick in reverting edits that are obviously vandalism, but Wikipedia relies on ordinary editors such as yourself to research the dubious edits and revert the ones that the bots miss. Why not WP:Create an account? Dbfirs 08:57, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
Beyond the bots that revert what appears to be vandalism, there is also mw:ORES which highlights potentially problematical edits for review by those editors who choose to use the "Revision scoring on Watchlist" option at Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-watchlist. --David Biddulph (talk) 09:11, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
  • From Why not create more bots to fight it (duplicating existing ones or ones made from scratch), I infer that you assume every bot can do a limited amount of work. If so, you are mistaken: bots are automated processes that can precisely do lots of work quickly, unlike humans; they do not tire and do not have edit limitations. (And, as described above, unlike humans, bots can only do the really basic stuff.) Sorry if that was obvious to you, but I have seen people get confused with much simpler computer stuff. TigraanClick here to contact me 12:57, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
  • Bots can run 24 hours a day 7 days a week, so once one is designed there is no reason to have another of the same design. The limitation is on the design. If someone can come up with a new test for vandalism that both detects a lot of vandalism and also doesn't lose us good edits then I'm sure we can get a bot writer to write a bot for it. For example we know that any edit that changes a school from being public to pubic is vandalism, and that edit including everything else done by that edit, the unusual name for the principal, the new school motto and the pink and sparkly colours for the football team can be reverted. The challenge is in finding such tests which can be coded into a computer rather than relying on humans to decide if an edit is vandalism or not. ϢereSpielChequers 16:32, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

Fredrikson Stallard

Hello, I have passed my 100th edit on this article and think it is now ready for publishing. Would someone please help?

Thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by Paradise lost 90 (talkcontribs) 15:00, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

As the template says, just be patient and it will receive a review soon. RhinosF1(chat)(status)(contribs) 15:12, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
Goodness, Paradise lost 90. I'm sure you've made more than that! This was your first edit to Draft:Fredrikson Stallard, and only the fifth edit this account name had ever made. It added 22,350 bytes to the new page; not bad for a beginner. Are you sure you haven't edited here before? Nick Moyes (talk) 15:39, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
Update: Conversation has somehow moved to my talk page at User_talk:Nick_Moyes#Question_from_Teahouse Nick Moyes (talk) 17:02, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

Confused new user

I am working on creating my first Wikipedia page. I have created an account. When I first started to create a page, there was no SAVE button - only Publish. So, the content I have written exists - but I'm confused on a few items.

First - on business pages, there is a right column on the page where company info appears. How do I create that on a blank page?

Second - how do you insert photos into the text so that the text wraps around the photo?

Third - when the page is done, how do you submit it for review and comments and (hopefully) posting?

Thanks Ken Crowhurst — Preceding unsigned comment added by KJ010110 (talkcontribs) 16:15, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse KJ010110. The infobox on the right is created with a template like {{infobox company}} (click on that link for the parameters). See Help:Files for how to upload and use photos. When your draft is ready for review, you can add {{subst:submit}} to the top. —teb728 t c 16:38, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
Looking at your userspace draft, KJ010110, I need to comment that Wikipedia is not for promotion: articles must be written from a neutral point of view. —teb728 t c 16:46, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
Indeed, Ken. Many people confuse Wikipedia with a business directory, or advertising medium. I suggest you will find it helpful to replace "create a business page" in your mind with "write an encyclopaedia article about a business". Wikipedia has little interest in what you say or want to say about your business - all it is interested in is what people who have no connection with your business have already chosen to publish about it. --ColinFine (talk) 17:05, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

I've uploaded a Poster Image to Wiki Commons and it keeps getting kicked back saying that it is a possible copyright violation.

Hi Guys,

I've uploaded a Poster Image to Wiki Commons and it keeps getting kicked back saying that it is a possible copyright violation. Firstly, it is my work, secondly, it has been in the public domain for 20 years, please help! here is the link to the image

And here is the link to the page where the Image currently resides

Many thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by Abbotstown (talkcontribs) 16:19, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

Hello, Abbotstown, Thanks for your question. Your image might be protected by copyright laws. Please don't upload in Commons instead upload in Wikipedia using File Upload Wizard or other tools. Please follow the guidelines and instructions there. Thanks
Masum Reza(talk) 16:28, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
looking into it... RhinosF1(chat)(status)(contribs) 16:35, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
I can actually see it was uploaded to English Wikipedia as non-free media and was deleted as it wasn't being used on any pages which is required for this. You can see the relevant deletion criteria here. I'm going to ping the deleting admin as I'm unsure if there was any other issues and will leave a message regarding image policy on your talk page. (pinging @Explicit:) RhinosF1(chat)(status)(contribs) 16:35, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
Hello, Abbotstown. The issue in Commons, you need to take up in Commons, not here; but I notice that there, you assert that is it PD, but give no evidence of that; and the IMDB source specifically claims copyright. Unfortunately, whether it is your own work or not is not relevant, unless you own the copyright.
If you successfully contest the deletion in Commons (presumably by adducing evidence of its PD status) then there will be no problem using it in Wikipedia. If you cannot do so, then in order to use it in Wikipedia, it must meet all the criteria in WP:NFCC.— Preceding unsigned comment added by ColinFine (talkcontribs) 17:20, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
(edit conflict) Distributing your own photograph of a copyright poster is illegal, so it would be wisest to delete the image from the article and from Commons, then reload a low-resolution version to Wikipedia and use it in the article under a WP:Fair use rationale. Dbfirs 17:23, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
(ec) Hello Abbotstown. On Commons you said the poster was in the public domain because "The image was released to all media as part of publicity for the film." The fact that it was released to the media does not mean that Maiden Voyage Pictures does not hold a copyright on it: it just means that the media are permitted to use it for publicity. Wikipedia and Commons require greater permission than that. See Masum Reza's advice above for how to use it as non-free content. —teb728 t c 17:44, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

Guidance for publishing frequency.


I had a question regarding the frequency of publishes an editor should be performing on behalf of an article. For example, in my past five edits I made two changes within 1 subheading. One edit was regarding the current title of a board member. For a second edit, I listed a factual and relevant statement regarding board member going on leave of absence.

As a best practice, and aid to future editors, should the above actions be a single or double publish?

Thank you for your time. Vcpecon (talk) 17:48, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

Entirely up to you, Vcpecon. It's a good idea not to do too many changes in one go, but if it's just a couple, you can do them in a single edit, or in two. --ColinFine (talk) 18:13, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

Business page creation


In response to a question I posted earlier today, I just received the following response:

"Looking at your userspace draft, KJ010110, I need to comment that Wikipedia is not for promotion: articles must be written from a neutral point of view. —teb728 t c 16:46, 29 January 2019 (UTC) Indeed, Ken. Many people confuse Wikipedia with a business directory, or advertising medium. I suggest you will find it helpful to replace "create a business page" in your mind with "write an encyclopaedia article about a business". Wikipedia has little interest in what you say or want to say about your business - all it is interested in is what people who have no connection with your business have already chosen to publish about it. --ColinFine (talk) 17:05, 29 January 2019 (UTC)"

I now fully understand the criteria that needs to be met for a page to be accepted.

However, I have a question for you. A competitor of ours is called OtterBox. They have a Wikipedia page:

Is their page allowed due to the numerous references (i.e., listing in Forbes, article in Reuters, etc.)? — Preceding unsigned comment added by KJ010110 (talkcontribs) 18:24, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

@KJ010110: Welcome to the Teahouse. You have hit upon one of the fundamental rules of Wikipedia, that articles need significant coverage in reliable sources in order for there to be an article written about them. We even have a guideline for the notability of articles about businesses. Media sources like Forbes and Inc with a reputation for solid journalism are a great way to establish notability. I would also note about the OtterBox article that it is written from a neutral point of view that states facts rather than tries to tell a story or make value judgements, which can be difficult to do if you have a conflict of interest in regards to the company (and if you do, you must disclose this fact, see WP:PAID). There are several problems with your draft, as ColinFine pointed out in his decline notice, and it needs to be rewritten from scratch to comply with our guidelines. Right now it reads like an advertisement. Hope this helps, shoy (reactions) 18:43, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

Koreans in Uzbekistan. What should I do ? How to deal with the statistics of dictatorial regimes that can be distorted?

I have a problem. There are official statistics of the Republic of Uzbekistan. However, it is clearly distorted. It does not reflect the mass exodus of Koreans from this republic between the years 2001-2016.

So from Uzbekistan 52 thousand Koreans returned to South Korea. However, in the state statistics of Uzbekistan this outcome is not recorded. The same statistics do not reflect the religious discrimination of Koreans in Uzbekistan - they are Christians of different denominations, and Uzbekistan is an Islamic country with a dictatorial regime.

The estimated real value of Koreans in Uzbekistan is 78 thousand. But official statistics show almost 100 thousand more.

What should I do ? How to deal with the statistics of dictatorial regimes that can be distorted?Hatchiko (talk) 23:39, 28 January 2019 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse Hatchiko. Do you have published reliable sources for the correct statistics? If so use that —teb728 t c 02:17, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
I see you have raised this issue at Talk:Koryo-saram#Figures_for_Uzbekistan, where you will probably get answers from more knowledgeable editors. Maybe wait until you get a reply there? Also, you should maybe make clearer that the issue is with the infobox number, not with any content of the article text. TigraanClick here to contact me 13:38, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
I should say, that there should almost never be information in an infobox which is not already discussed and explained in the article itself. The infobox is a summary of the article text, and anything listed there should be in the main body of the article where it can be given context and expanded upon sufficiently. Infoboxes are not good places to do that, and especially where information is disputable or needs clarification. It may be in the infobox, but it should always be in the text before one puts it there. --Jayron32 19:03, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

Lost sandbox file

Hello, I’m still a newbie. I tried to update an existing page and all of my updates were rejected for mostly good reasons. So, OK, I decided to create a new page that I could tweak and test before trying to replace the old wiki entry. I created a new file called User:Gretchencotter/sandbox. I have now entered data twice but every time I come back in order to add more data, the file no longer exists. My slow, tedious typing efforts have vanished. I don’t think my file is being actively deleted, I just don’t think it is being saved when I use the Publish button.

Any help would be appreciated. I am trying to recreate the biography of Liv8ng people for Shimon Gibson (at his request), but so far with zero success.

Thank you Gretchen Cotter User:Gretchencotter Gretchencotter (talk) 18:53, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

User:Gretchencotter/sandbox appears never to have been created. If you typed something there, then you don't seem to have clicked on "Publish" to save it. You should not recreate an article with the intention of replacing an existing article, but instead make valid changes to the existing article. You have a WP:Conflict of interest, and possibly WP:Paid status, so you should suggest edits on the talk page of the article Talk:Shimon Gibson instead of trying to edit the article directly. I see that you have already used that page to ask about the photograph. Wikipedia has no interest in whether the subject of an article likes the page, and no permission of the subject is required, but if there are inaccuracies, then you need to find WP:Reliable sources that report the correct information, and post those on the talk page. If there are existing statements that are untrue and unreferenced, then please let us know so that we can remove them. Dbfirs 19:12, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
@Dbfirs: I thought the issue was that they pressed the button but it didn't save it. @Gretchencotter: what message were you shown after you clicked the button? -A lainsane (Channel 2) 19:26, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
If they did, then it didn't work. I occasionally click on the publish button and nothing happens, but I blame my ancient computer and slow internet for that. Dbfirs 20:02, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
@Gretchencotter: On the bottom left there's a blue button that says publish changes. You have to click it when you are done. Per above, if you have a conflict of interest, you can always ping me by leaving a comment on my talk page and I can review your changes and see if they are properly sourced and neutral. I also left you info on Dr. Gibson's talk page about uploading a new photo for the article. TimTempleton (talk) (cont) 19:34, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

New page creation

I am new to Wikipedia and whilst I've attempted to ensure that content is true and neutral, the page have been instantly deleted. I believe that the content is of interest especially given the move towards lightweighting within the automotive sector. The title regards the introduction of this new technology - not the promotion of a specific company or product. It would be helpful if those issuing speedy deletions could provide more assistance rather than placing threats on my admin ability or future edits.

Please help Graham M Jelfs (talk) 17:11, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

Hello, Graham M Jelfs. Not being an admin, I can't see the deleted article. But your wording above sounds as if your purpose is to tell the world about something. That is precisely what we mean in Wikipedia by "promotion" - not all promotion is commercial. It might sound paradoxical, but Wikipedia is emphatically not for telling the world about things: it is only for summarising what the world has already been told about things: this is why we insist on subjects of articles being notable. --ColinFine (talk) 17:27, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
Hi Graham M Jelfs. I hear you when you say you attempted to be neutral, and yet the article was about as close to pure advertising in tone and content as I've ever seen. It was filled with what I would term corporate ad-speak – praising HFQ in glowing terms to convince the reader of its wonderful virtues ("The multiple benefits enabled by HFQ® Technology ... HFQ® Technology enables investment reduction... adopted across a vast range of applications and markets... involving major players across the global ecosystem to offer a compelling full-service proposition..."[1][2][3] and so on. The fact that it sounded like a commercial follows from the fact that you copied and pasted much of the content from external sites authored by HFQ, where it's promoting itself. I've noted the copyright violations in the deleted page's log history. I will leave a message at your talk page about that issue.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 02:52, 30 January 2019 (UTC)


  1. ^ "HFQ Technology Market Sectors/". Retrieved January 30, 2019.
  2. ^ "linkedin profile for HFQ Partner Network". Retrieved January 30, 2019.
  3. ^ "HFQ Technology Home Impression Technologies: Hot Form Quench". Retrieved January 30, 2019.

Wikipedia Biography Page

Hi I am Kelsey Murrell and I am new to wikipedia and I would like to get help with creating a biography page. How do I get started? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kelzmurrell (talkcontribs) 20:57, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

@Kelzmurrell: Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. If you mean that you want to write about yourself, I think that you have misunderstood the purpose of Wikipedia. Wikipedia is an encyclopedia and not a place for people to tell the world about themselves. Autobiographical edits are strongly discouraged per the Autobiography policy written at WP:AUTO. Not every person merits an article here. If you meet Wikipedia notability guidelines and merit an article, you should allow others who take note of you in independent reliable sources to write it.
If you mean that you want to introduce yourself to the Wikipedia community in the context of your Wikipedia editing or use, you do have a userpage where you can do that, but it is not meant for you to give your entire biography; please see WP:USERPAGE for what is acceptable user page content.
If you mean something else, please clarify. 331dot (talk) 21:05, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
If your intentions are not to write about yourself, may I suggest that you spend a couple months editing existing biographies prior to creating a new one? Our criteria for new articles is called notability, and it is a rather difficult concept for new editors to master. There are literally dozens of ways to show notability and most are dependent on who you are writing about. Notability is not a factor in adding information to existing articles. John from Idegon (talk) 06:26, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Getting full Wikipedia on a mobile device

Is it possible to avoid the ".m." version, and get full Wikipedia on my mobile phone? The constraints of this "mobile version" are driving me crazy. The latest example is that I wanted to look at a page's edit history. That is so easy on the desktop that I figured "how hard can it be?" I can't find it anywhere on the mobile site. Worse still, when I select the option to use the desktop site it doesn't! The layout is slightly improved, but it still uses the ".m." site, with no history. Even when I manually edit the URL to remove the ".m." it automatically puts it back in to prevent me from being able to use the system. I have gone through the mobile editing instructions and I just can't find a way to force it to do the right thing - any pointers? Gronk Oz (talk) 02:33, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Here may be a solution.Tamanoeconomico (talk) 03:49, 30 January 2019 (UTC)
@Tamanoeconomico: thanks for that. Wow, that is so complicated for something that seems like it should be so simple. At least it makes me feel better about not finding a solution myself. Not knowing anything about Java, it makes me a bit nervous - is that process safe? Have you tried it out?--Gronk Oz (talk) 05:38, 30 January 2019 (UTC)
@Gronk Oz: For what it's worth, for me there's a link at the bottom of Wikipedia pages that says "request desktop version" or something very similar, and that works. I'd be more definite in the details but my cellphone's out of charge. (Iphone, using Chrome.)--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 05:38, 30 January 2019 (UTC)
@Fuhghettaboutit: thanks, I tried that. It displays a somewhat improved layout, but it still forces constant changes over to the ".m." version of the site, with no option to see the article's history.--Gronk Oz (talk) 05:41, 30 January 2019 (UTC)
hmm, here's another technical article that makes no sense to me;-)--Fuhghettaboutit (talk)
For myself, I'm very glad we have plenty of folks that understand that stuff, so I don't have to. Here's what I do, Gronk Oz, and I edit almost exclusively on an android device.
Use your browser to navigate to Wikipedia (I use Chrome), whatever page you usually start at and sign in (I use my watchlist). Scroll to the bottom of the page and select desktop version. This is the important part....once you are on whatever page you like to start with, signed in (with the stay signed in box checked) and on the desktop version, use the three dots thingie on your browser and set a desktop shortcut. From then on, at least until you sign out or are signed out, the desktop version of that page will open from the shortcut, and any link you open from that will be desktop version. Works just fine for me. John from Idegon (talk) 06:18, 30 January 2019 (UTC)
Works for me, too. I do most of my daytime editing on a small iphone in desktop view. Apart from the lack of the keyboard there is no difference. But then I do have the advantage of being able to dictate what I write, as I've done here. Regards Nick Moyes (talk) 08:14, 30 January 2019 (UTC)
I do the vast majority of my editing on an Android smartphone, and I always use the fully functional desktop site on my phone. I ignore the mediocre mobile site and the apps, except for occasional testing. I have been recommending for years that the misleading term "desktop site" be abandoned, because it implies that you need a big expensive heavy computer to use it, and that is false. It works perfectly well on modern mobile devices and should have a better name. It should be the default for all users, in my opinion. Cullen328 Let's discuss it 08:43, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

──────────── Wow, I thought I was the only one - thanks for the moral support. I am trying to follow John from Idegon's directions on my Android (Samsung S9+) using Chrome, but I am experiencing technical difficulties - the mobile site is fighting against me all the way. First, there does not seem to be any way to get to my Watchlist (never mind, that would be nice but not vital). Then trying to log in, I enter my userid and password. There is no checkbox to "stay logged in". I press the Login button. But it pops up a window insisting that I choose whether to perform this action using the Wikipedia mobile app, or Samsung's internet browser (there is no option to continue using Chrome). I chose the latter. This takes me to a "Central user log in" screen, which displays the following error message in red: "No active login attempt is in progress for your session." I have no idea how to proceed from there... P.S. I was typing this message on my desktop while trying to get the mobile working, and the mobile crash described above also logged this desktop session off. I will have to copy what I wrote, log in, and paste it back here...--Gronk Oz (talk) 09:54, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

I think it might be solved! Smile.gif The missing step was to force Android to use Chrome as its default browser, instead of Samsung Internet (Android Settings > Apps > 3 dots > Default Apps > Browser App > select Chrome). Then after rebooting the phone to clean everything out, I was able to follow John from Idegon's directions! Now, time will tell whether it keeps working - but since so many of you are able to do it then I'm sure it will be okay. Thanks, again, everybody! --Gronk Oz (talk) 10:20, 30 January 2019 (UTC)
Glad you're sorted and you're certainly not alone. I agree with Cullen328 about the poor choice of wording for 'desktop view' - maybe 'full view' and 'mobile view' would be more helpful. Isn't it time we made noises to WMF to get it changed? (As a complete aside - but relevant to browser choice - anyone trying to edit pages using Puffin browser will get a rude shock when they suddenly discover they've been blocked. It panicked me at first, but relates to the browser using a proxy server to access Wikipedia, and that's not allowed as it enables untraceable vandalism.) Nick Moyes (talk) 10:50, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Missing links

Hello I was trying so many times to click on this previous page but couldn't get through was idoing something wrong — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ana jerie (talkcontribs) 12:12, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Hi. What page were you trying to go back to? This sounds like a browser problem though. Maybe you openend a page in a new tab or you didn't open anything before this page. TruthToBeSpoken (talk) 13:45, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Art pop genre of music

Why isn't artists of this genre get enough airplay here on mainstream radio in SA but the other side of the world knows about them? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ana jerie (talkcontribs) 04:39, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Hi Ana jerie. The Teahouse is generally a place for asking questions about Wikipedia, but it doesn't seem as if your question has anything to do with editing Wikipedia at all. You could try asking this at Wikipedia:Reference desk/Entertainment; however, if you really want to why radio stations in SA (maybe you mean San Antonio?) don't play the music of certain artists or certain types of music, you probably should try directly contacting the radio stations themselves and asking them. -- Marchjuly (talk) 04:58, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Sorry what I meant was why doesn't Wikipedia have audio samples of what an ARTPOP song sounds like just a 30sec sample sorry for the misunderstAnding A.jerie 10:28, 30 January 2019 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ana jerie (talkcontribs)

Ana jerie I've transferred your post here from the Teahouse talk page(which is for discussing the operation of the Teahouse, this page). Please keep follow up questions here. Thanks 331dot (talk) 10:55, 30 January 2019 (UTC)
Hello, Ana jerie. The article Art pop has three fair-use samples. Two of them are clearly precursors (The Beach Boys and the Beatles), but the caption to the sample of Kate Bush says "According to The Concordian, "Running Up That Hill" was part of the most distinctive and revolutionary works of 1980s art pop, containing "darting drum rhythms" and Bush's "dogged vocals". So it looks to me as if the answer is that it does have a sample. If you think it should have more, or more recent, the answer is "because nobody has put them there": anybody can do so. I suggest you identify a significant track, and post a request on Talk:Art pop. Remember that the criteria for fair-use on Wikipedia include "Non-free content is used only if its presence would significantly increase readers' understanding of the article topic, and its omission would be detrimental to that understanding"; and also that "multiple items of non-free content are not used if one item can convey equivalent significant information", so it is possible that a new sample ought to replace one of those already there. (Actually, I'm wondering whether it is justified to have both the Beach Boys and the Beatles clips there. But I know nothing about the field). --ColinFine (talk) 14:05, 30 January 2019 (UTC)


That's how life would feel like if there was no earth because there are so many planets but only earth can have life has one ever thought about how life would be like living in mercury just try and think about it if there's proof that mars can be our earth surely you can Believe that mercury is more than capable than being our third world everyday something changes but we as humans on earth don't realise it but as you think about it maybe the realisation that mercury can be a world where we can live without a shadow of possibility everything and anything isreally inevitable so think about it mercury as our third world maybe it is possible but not unthinkableA.jerie 12:42, 30 January 2019 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ana jerie (talkcontribs)

Others planets were life is possible and may exists.. Maybe there's some planets that are way more advanced than we are. We don't know, and we can't be sure at this moment. Maybe life is just a computer simulation??? It's not possible to check if we do or don't live in one. Can we? TruthToBeSpoken (talk) 13:38, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

@Ana jerie: Please don't spam. It's NOT a forum. --CiaPan (talk) 13:40, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

@Ana jerie: What CiaPan means is that you are welcome to ask questions at the Teahouse about editing Wikipedia, but you may not post random thoughts, musings or personal observations either here or on any article talk page (which you have been doing rather a lot of!) This must stop right now as you are, unfortunately, now dangerously close to being blocked from editing for repeatedly leaving such trivial comments. Just try and appreciate that we are all here for the serious task of building an amazing encyclopaedia about notable subjects. None of us are interested in what any individual person happens to think. So you really must not leave comments like these ever again. Best wishes and good luck with your Wikipedia journey. If you have any questions about how to edit, feel free to ask them here. Did you manage to access the Wikipedia Adventure in the end? Regards, Nick Moyes (talk) 14:06, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Could you update the number of Oscar nominated movies for Film of th e Year, since you have teh new ones at teh bottom of the page

The new number of Oscar nominated movies is eight more than the total (546) you have on your site. The number is now 554 movies have been nominated for movie of the year, and the new winner (the 91st) will be announced on Feb 24. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2603:3003:36DD:8000:0:0:0:44E9 (talk) 15:50, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Editing page contact and adding references

Hello all,

I have never worked in Wikipedia before, I am trying to make content changes to some existing pages and I need to add references for the content. I have been typing the new content in sandbox, do I post the content first and then add the references? Thank you in advance — Preceding unsigned comment added by Sullivanlab (talkcontribs) 14:28, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Hi, welcome to Wikipedia. It's probably best to cite your sources while writing the text, instead of doing it after you published the text. If you publish a article without citations to the main article space (not your sandbox) it's very likely to be deleted within a couple of hours, see WP:NRSNVNA. If you want to know how to cite a source see this tutorial: Wikipedia:Tutorial/Citing sources. If you have any further questions feel free to ask. Kind regards, TruthToBeSpoken (talk) 15:03, 30 January 2019 (UTC)
PS. Please sign your posts with four ~~~~ next time.
@Sullivanlab: Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. Your edit history indicates that edits have been made from your account since December 19, but you say that you haven't worked here before. Please clarify. I would also note that if "Sullivan lab" is an organization, you will need to change your username(instructions on how to do that are at WP:CHU). 331dot (talk) 15:05, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Thank you for your replies. As requested, to clarify I am new to wikipedia entries and every attempted edit has been rejected since December. Regarding adding the references, thank you for your advice-after I have edited the existing text how do I add the references? Do I simply number them and type them under the edited text? I am working on a small section of an existing page where other authors have contributed their content and their own references exist on that page. I do not want to mess up their references. Thank you wikiaccountssa — Preceding unsigned comment added by Wikiaccountsa (talkcontribs) 15:32, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Hi. Please read this tutorial on how to add references (see the part about the refbar it's the easiest way). Wikipedia:Tutorial/Citing sources. Kind regards, TruthToBeSpoken (talk) 15:38, 30 January 2019 (UTC)
I'm confused! Is Sullivanlab the same person as Wikiaccountsa? Neither username sounds like that of an individual, though it might be? Dbfirs 16:24, 30 January 2019 (UTC)
It appears that you started in December adding content to articles (under one name) - all reverted because you did not provide references. Then, you deleted large sections of two articles without providing reason - also reverted. Now, you are attempting to create a new article as a draft (Causes of ADHD) when that topic is well-covered in the ADHD article. Your User name change is OK as long as you stick with the new name and never use the old name. David notMD (talk) 16:34, 30 January 2019 (UTC)
If you want to work on a section of an article, one way is to copy to your sandbox, work there, then replace what is in the article with your revised content. That is different from creating a draft. Whether you are editing in place or sandbox and back, if you are using the proper procedure for references, yours are inserted into the list of references, and all references following are automatically renumbered. David notMD (talk) 16:37, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Thank you for your responses. I will continue to work on my edits.

Edit Revert


My name's Ajani and I recently made some updates to Photographer Chris Buck's Wikipedia page as some of the information on it is outdated or grammatically incorrect. The changes I made were reverted twice. I'd love to know why this may be as thy were minor changes. Perhaps it interrupted with the Wikipdia guidelines? If so, I'd like to know exactly how and work towards updating those changes.

If I can hear back as soon as possible, that would be fantastic.

Cheers, Ajani— Preceding unsigned comment added by AjaniD (talkcontribs) 16:50, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Hi Ajani Take a look at the edit history for that topic. The editors who reverted your changes explained the reversions in their edit summaries. Both of them suggested you use the Talk page to discuss the major deletions that you want to make. Get consensus on the Talk page for your changes, and then you can make the edits without being reverted. (Edited to add:) Also, a "minor" change is fixing a typo or punctuation; your changes were not minor.Schazjmd (talk) 16:55, 30 January 2019 (UTC)
(edit conflict) As User:Darren-M has told you, you are removing sourced edits and editing against the WP:MOS. I'm trying to get in touch with him to see if he can explain better. RhinosF1(chat)(status)(contribs) 16:56, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Help with a site thats up for deletion


The will gray wiki page as been flagged up for deletion

I've been talking to one of your hosts and he wrote/suggested the below and to get in touch with yourself if there were any questions or help needed.

"Except, that is, for the rather select membership of the Inner Magic Circle. It's just possible that that might be deemed suitable under WP:ANYBIO. That could potentially be a clincher, so can you supply any evidence of this membership other than the Will Gray website? Newspaper articles etc?"

I have two PDF's one which is the letter from the president himself congratulating Will on being promoted to MIMC which is an outstanding accolade and one of the Magic Circle minutes where it is mentioned in the secretary's report.

Would they be best to be put on as citation links or just links. Should I link these myself while its under discussion or can these be linked by another host or author.

I did put a citation link to Will winning 3rd at The Magic Circle Close up Comp which is no easy task either.

I'm really hoping it doesn't come down to deletion but do understand why these things happen any further help would be great.--Vanishingrabbit (talk) 11:58, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

I'm afraid neither of those sources will do, Vanisgingrabbit. All information in Wikipedia articles must be available in a published source. It doesn't sound as if either of those is published (and uploading them would not change that, as well as probably being a copyright infringement). Sorry. --ColinFine (talk) 14:09, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Hi Colin I'm not sure what to do then, I'm sure you're aware how private the magic circle is and doesn't allow anyone thats a non member to see their membership list or private section of their website. When you say published do you mean somewhere on the internet or in an article i.e. magazine or a photo of the actual certificate. --Vanishingrabbit (talk) 15:54, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

A source needs to be possible to verify. It need not be free, cheap, or easy to do so, but it needs to be possible. A private letter or private meeting minutes probably would not fall under that category unless it is published somewhere publicly available. 331dot (talk) 16:06, 30 January 2019 (UTC)
Four of your sources make no mention of Gray, all sources MUST support the actual content they are placed after. Theroadislong (talk) 16:17, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Thank you I see now thanks for the help, I've corrected three of them which now go to an independent news page which mentions Will winning the awards there next too. I have copyright to a photo of Will actually being presented his MIMC would this help verifying that if on the page.--Vanishingrabbit (talk) 17:58, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Who has access to make needed updates to a page?

The Eldorado, Texas page needs to be edited. Who can do that? — Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 17:59, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Welcome to Wikipedia and thanks for wanting to make it better. Link: Eldorado,_Texas. Anyone may edit that article, including you. You can Be Bold or discuss the issue on the article's talk page. Any changes you make must be supported by citations to reliable sources. You might want to start with WP:TUTORIAL. RudolfRed (talk) 18:03, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Adding photographic content

I've used Wikipedia for years, but have only recently created a login so that I can contribute. My primary interest is adding photographic content where it is needed. How do I discover articles that would benefit from photos? Thanks, -Ilgamoot — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ilgamoot (talkcontribs) 17:33, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

@Ilgamoot: Category:Wikipedia requested images should be helpful. RhinosF1(chat)(status)(contribs) 17:42, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Great. Thanks for the pointer. That's quite a list. I noticed that there are "wikiprojects" that might help me filter or constrain the list a bit by my location. Unfortunately, when I searched for "San Francisco Photography" etc within the projects, I didn't find anything relevant. Can you suggest a better way to find a group working on photos in the SF Bay Area, US? --Ilgamoot (talk) 18:36, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Ilgamoot, there is Wikipedia:WikiProject_California/San_Francisco_Bay_Area_task_force but it is a bit dormant. You could try the parent California wiki project, or go to commons:Category:San_Francisco_Bay_Area and see what is missing. WelpThatWorked (talk) 18:43, 30 January 2019 (UTC)
Ilgamoot, just found this, Category:Wikipedia_requested_photographs_in_the_San_Francisco_Bay_Area to see requested photos for the bay area WelpThatWorked (talk) 18:45, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Possible future admin nomination

How long does it usually take for someone to get admin nominated? I previously was nominated (but failed) on Wikivoyage. I know I have a checkered past on both sites, so if you tell me how long I should wait to apply, make it about double the normal time. Libertarianmoderate (talk) 01:47, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

This Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Libertarianmoderate/Archive suggests you had/have sockpuppets, at least at Wikivoyage. You were also blocked, then unblocked in December (description you deleted from your Talk page). Highly unlikely you will ever make Admin. David notMD (talk) 02:42, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
I suggest that you spend the next three years (at least) making only constructive edits, and no silly comments. Also avoid creating or using any sockpuppet accounts, and show that you have a thorough understanding of Wikipedia policies, then you might consider applying, and some editors might vote for you. I've been editing for more than ten years, and do not yet feel that I have a thorough enough understanding of some policies to apply for adminship. Dbfirs 09:06, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
Edits like this [2] would suggest that you are not serious about editing here let alone gaining admin rights. Theroadislong (talk) 10:18, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
User:Theroadislong - I think that editors like the one in question are always serious about wanting admin privileges, even if they are not serious about collaborative editing. That is why we need to be careful about them. Robert McClenon (talk) 19:07, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Update Biography Photo

I would like to replace the biography photo of my wife Deborah Chase Hopkins with a more current photo. How do I do that? THANKS! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Hopflys (talkcontribs) 17:58, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Hopflys, You should read the WP:COI policy first then use {{request edit}} on the article talk page. RhinosF1(chat)(status)(contribs) 18:13, 30 January 2019 (UTC)
Also, Hopflys, you need to be aware of copright issues. Wikipedia requires that most pictures be licensed in a way that anybody can reuse them for any purpose. If you, or your wife, or somebody associated with you has (i.e. holds the copyright of) a suitable picture, and is willing to release it, it would be most welcome. They should go to the Upload wizard, and upload the picture to Wikimedia commons; then it can be used in an article. See donating copyright materials. --ColinFine (talk) 18:19, 30 January 2019 (UTC)
Hello Hopflys, if you take a photo of yourself, you could release it under an appropriate license. Usually professional photographers do not release their photos under a license acceptable to Wikipedia. —teb728 t c 19:37, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Undefined Rejection


I recently submitted two separate articles for publishing and both were rejected for an undefined reason..

Could you please help me to understand. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Professor talbot (talkcontribs) 20:06, 27 January 2019 (UTC)

In each case the reviewer left a comment on the draft page. --David Biddulph (talk) 20:10, 27 January 2019 (UTC)
And you are actually three for three on declined. Bluntly, your references are not good enough to confirm these businesses or people as notable by Wikipedia's standards. A couple were one-sentence mentions, when what is needed are longer, more detailed publications about the topics. One was a interview with the subject. What a person says about themselves or their business is not a reliable source. For Draft:Jersey Champs in particular, your 2nd and 3rd refs are both to the same interview. Your 1st ref is just a company financial profile. David notMD (talk) 20:15, 27 January 2019 (UTC)
Professor talbot, I am sorry but I have deleted your drafts as unambiguously promotional. Please be aware that Wikipedia is not a promotional platform. Cullen328 Let's discuss it 02:17, 28 January 2019 (UTC)
OP now blocked as a sock. --David Biddulph (talk) 20:40, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

William Sherrill

Can an admin please tell me what was here? I don't like to overwrite things. I assume it may be about a non-notable person with this name in the contemporary film industry or possibly the Minister from North Carolina? Thanks. I am about to redirect to William L. Sherrill FloridaArmy (talk) 21:24, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

It was a biography about someone nonnotable from the 18th century. Based on the text I think you are safe to create the redirect. 331dot (talk) 21:32, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Port of Key West Essay to Encyclopedic style

Hello. I am wondering what needs to be changed about Port of Key West. I know thee is something wrong with Port of Key West but I do not know what it is. Whether I am told or a more experience editor fixes the problem, the problem is fixed. Please fix this. And notify me (or perhaps not the latter!) Also, a rating on the Importance Scale may be helpful. (Mr. Holup (talk) 22:28, 30 January 2019 (UTC))

Copyrighted contend


My entry was deleted because there was copyrighted contend in it. I think the relevant content is a table. The owner of the original article asked me to put in there. So my question is if there is a way to upload the table with his permission even though it's copyrighted? If yes how could he give this permission?

Thank you! Gianna — Preceding unsigned comment added by GiannaHenkel (talkcontribs) 07:23, 28 January 2019 (UTC)

The process for him to release the copyright, if he wishes to do so, is at WP:Donating copyrighted material. Otherwise, you will have to reword things in your own words. --David Biddulph (talk) 07:29, 28 January 2019 (UTC)

Thans for the quick reply! Is there also a way to find out if there are other copyrighted phrases in the text? — Preceding unsigned comment added by GiannaHenkel (talkcontribs) 07:38, 28 January 2019 (UTC)

Anything that has previously been published elsewhere is copyrighted (whether or not specifically labelled as such), unless specifically defined as free from copyright or released under an appropriate licence. There is further explanation at WP:FAQ/Copyright. The simple answer is to write the article in your own words. --David Biddulph (talk) 07:46, 28 January 2019 (UTC)
On your User page, you will need to declare whether your connection to the owner/author of the table is paid. If not paid, you will still need to indicate a conflict of interest. David notMD (talk) 10:57, 28 January 2019 (UTC)
User:GiannaHenkel - I have several comments. First, the draft reads as if it was copied from a book, so it likely is copyrighted. You are responsible for ensuring that anything that you submit to Wikipedia is free of copyright. Second, the owner of the copyright needs to be aware of what is meant by donating copyrighted material for use in Wikipedia. It does not just mean approving the publication of the copyrighted material in Wikipedia with a copyright notice. (That is a reasonable misconception.) The owner of the copyright has to release the copyright for use subject to the Creative Commons copyleft by anyone in the world. Most copyright holders do not want to do that. Third, it isn't necessary to create three copies of the submission, as you have done. It wastes the time of the reviewers and annoys the reviewers. Please request that two of the copies be deleted. Robert McClenon (talk) 05:10, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Hey Robert! Thank you for your answer! First of all: how do i delete submissions? I can't even find one anymore... (sorry that's my first time drafting something on Wikipedia). <-- i think i found the solution and deleted two of them! Secondly: the actually text I submitted is written by me and the author of the original articles about personal initiative. It is kind of difficult to find broader sources because until now he and a few other researchers at his department (most co-authors) are the only researchers in this field. That's why the submission is quiet close to the original articles. How could we solve this problem?

Thank you un advance! — Preceding unsigned comment added by GiannaHenkel (talkcontribs) 01:07, 31 January 2019 (UTC)

stopping inappropriate content

Could someone tell what to do when incited content and bad links get reverted over and over again?Stevenvieczorek (talk) 00:59, 31 January 2019 (UTC)

Stevenvieczorek Welcome to Teahouse. I believe you were referring to Bluestone by an IP editor. You would give warnings to the editor (disruptive) using Wikipedia:Twinkle. The IP editor has received their last warning - see Here and if they continue to edit the same fashion as before you could report them to WP:AIV. Thank you. CASSIOPEIA(talk) 01:22, 31 January 2019 (UTC)